It's a shame... (jazz, old music, pop, rock, itunes)

Gentleman Johnny · 11-04-2007, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by right-track

FUCK OFF!

everything before this in r-t's post is unecessary.

**swim** · 11-04-2007, 03:33 PM

There's a decline in music because a store doesn't have a certain album?

weleasewoger72 · 11-04-2007, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackhammer

Jazz-mmm..nice. Sorry can't get John Thomson from the Fast Show out of my head!

YouTube - the fast show - jazz club xmas special

Nice!

TheBig3KilledMyRainDog · 11-04-2007, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exodizer

Your explaining my point perfectly, thank you. Yes their are 42 (or when I was there alot more) bands playing at New Orleans. But to find great Jazz bands nowadays you have to be in New Orleans. You say can the compose an argument with a vocabulary above a second grader? You do realize that in Music Theory you study two types of music (actually five or six depending on whether you took some class about Josquin). Jazz and Classical (Baroque, Classical, Romantic and Neoclassical). Why do you think Jazz is in there? Because it's old Music? Of course not it's because the greatest people at rhythm who have ever lived were Jazz composer. They used Synocopation (empasizing notes that are not on the beat) to create Dissoance. It's not easy to do and thats completely apart from the many Jazz composers brilliant chord progressions (I think John Coltrane was the best at this). 3 major festivals (and at the New Orleans festival only one tent acutally has Jazz)!? Do you know how many classical festivals there are? No it's damn hard to count. There was an age when Jazz was much bigger than classical. I have no problem getting Jazz off itunes of other sources of questionable legality. I'm saying that they didn't have Take Five by Dave Brubeck one of the all time greatest selling Jazz albums. That's infuriating. Seriously that would be like not having a single recording of Beethoven's Ninth. It just shouldn't happen.

Ok I'm not sure what point of yours I've proved, I said the current state of Jazz music is fine, you said it was in decline.

I said I can find new jazz constantly, you said you can't find a CD at a store (you're problem there might be the store by the way.) Not that it should matter, I went to our local indie chain and couldn't get Levon Helm's new CD. It happened to be sold out but there created iTunes for a reason. Burn the damn thing.

Why should they have Take 5? Or any Alfred Brendel covering Beethoven? Stores are businesses. They don't stock their shelves with elitist philosophy and stand on principle, their children need to eat. If its a chain, they need to keep sales moving.

Theres not going to be a music chain store that is the aural equivalent of McDonalds. For anything worth while, you have to work for it. For better quality you have to pay a little more. This is the way of the world.

And the vocabulary comment wasn't aimed a jazz composers it was aimed at you. Jumping the gun their sally. I took roughly 7 years of composition theory, I played piano for 5 and I graduated college with 2 degrees in arrogant elitism (eng, polisci). If its an elitist-off that you want, you can have it, but coming at me with a text book knowledge and zero real world application isn't going to get you anywhere.

And by the way, I'd put money on half of Brubeck's sales being from music teachers getting something to teach people about alternative time signatures, and the other half because when it came out it was the poppiest **** going. If you're going to complain make it about someone worth a damn like Art Tatum.

Exodizer · 11-07-2007, 11:53 AM

Did you know even Vladimir Horowitz liked Art Tatum. That I find hard to believe but it's a story told time and time again by jazz musicians. Vladmir Horowitz had no respect for Arthur Rubinstein yet he thought Art Tatum was one of the greatest pianists of the day. Still Art Tatum sounds like Micheal Angelo Batio on guitar. There's generally no melody just extremely fast playing. Yeah sure Take Five was the poppiest "****", and one of the most popular which is why you should still be able to find it in a damn record store like you can find any crooners entire discography. Have you been to a Jazz festival recently, There's no Jazz. In the New Orleans one they play Cajuin, Rock, Hip Hop, Zydeco, Country, Rthyhm and Blues and very little Jazz. Just take the most famous Frank Zappa quote, "Jazz isn't dead it just smells funny". I'm no more Elitist than any kid who listens to virtually any kind of music. They all think their opinon is right and so do you. I never checked for Brendel, but they sure as hell have Horowitz or Rubinstein and definatly Herbert Von Karajan even Leonard Bernstein. Leonard Berstein was the poppiest "****" around when it came out. As for the Second grade comment, and you claiming to be an English major, you know it sounded incredible racist rather than your actual point. I seriously thought it was a slur against African Americans, but I guess you just didn't get that, that was what it implied.

**right-track** · 11-07-2007, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exodizer

.As for the Second grade comment, and you claiming to be an English major, you know it sounded incredible racist rather than your actual point. I seriously thought it was a slur against African Americans, but I guess you just didn't get that, that was what it implied.

Now you have my undivided attention.

I'd like to know how Big3 claiming to be an English major sounded "incredibly racist".
Further more I'd like to know exactly, in detail please, how you "seriously" construed it to be "a slur against African Americans", because it seems Big3 wasn't the only one who didn't get it.

Incredibly...neither did I.

Care to elaborate?

**Urban Hatemonger** · 11-07-2007, 12:35 PM

I thought it was a slur against stupid people myself.

**right-track** · 11-07-2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

I thought it was a slur against stupid people myself.

Racist!

**sleepy jack fire drill** · 11-07-2007, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exodizer

Did you know even Vladimir Horowitz liked Art Tatum. That I find hard to believe but it's a story told time and time again by jazz musicians. Vladmir Horowitz had no respect for Arthur Rubinstein yet he thought Art Tatum was one of the greatest pianists of the day. Still Art Tatum sounds like Micheal Angelo Batio on guitar. There's generally no melody just extremely fast playing. Yeah sure Take Five was the poppiest "****", and one of the most popular which is why you should still be able to find it in a damn record store like you can find any crooners entire discography. Have you been to a Jazz festival recently, There's no Jazz. In the New Orleans one they play Cajuin, Rock, Hip Hop, Zydeco, Country, Rthyhm and Blues and very little Jazz. Just take the most famous Frank Zappa quote, "Jazz isn't dead it just smells funny". I'm no more Elitist than any kid who listens to virtually any kind of music. They all think their opinon is right and so do you. I never checked for Brendel, but they sure as hell have Horowitz or Rubinstein and definatly Herbert Von Karajan even Leonard Bernstein. Leonard Berstein was the poppiest "****" around when it came out. As for the Second grade comment, and you claiming to be an English major, you know it sounded incredible racist rather than your actual point. I seriously thought it was a slur against African Americans, but I guess you just didn't get that, that was what it implied.

Hey, no one cares what you learned in music history.

davidMC1982 · 11-07-2007, 02:40 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it classical music that uses syncopation to create dissonance, whereas in jazz it is the norm? Furthermore, isn't that irrelevant when considering the "worthiness" of a particular style of music? Syncopation is no more a difficult concept than any other element of musical theory.

This apparent snobbery, found particularly in the followers of jazz and classical music, is no different to the blind fanaticism shown by followers of all other genres and in some cases, particular artists. Truth be known, good music is good music irrespective of genre. To disregard an entire genre due to nothing but prejudice (to pre-judge) is one and the same as putting a specific genre on a pedestal. To do so implies a closed mind; one which cannot truly be enjoying music for what it is, since enjoyable music can be found everywhere.

Now to the point of the thread, which seems to be asking why a particular store did not stock Dave Brubeck's Take Five. Could it not be that the album in question is so popular the store had simply sold out? The secondary point, is jazz music dying, is quite obviously nonsense. Jazz is dying no more so than classical, rock, blues and any other genre you care to mention. The majority of available music will be whatever is popular at any given time and the rest will be the best of what came before.

Dave

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11-04-2007, 03:33 PM
swim Everyone Does Everything. Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: I'm back f-ucking or sleeping or something Posts: 4,350	There's a decline in music because a store doesn't have a certain album? __________________ you should be ashamed to be so proud of what you got

11-07-2007, 11:53 AM
Exodizer Groupie Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 34	Did you know even Vladimir Horowitz liked Art Tatum. That I find hard to believe but it's a story told time and time again by jazz musicians. Vladmir Horowitz had no respect for Arthur Rubinstein yet he thought Art Tatum was one of the greatest pianists of the day. Still Art Tatum sounds like Micheal Angelo Batio on guitar. There's generally no melody just extremely fast playing. Yeah sure Take Five was the poppiest "**", and one of the most popular which is why you should still be able to find it in a damn record store like you can find any crooners entire discography. Have you been to a Jazz festival recently, There's no Jazz. In the New Orleans one they play Cajuin, Rock, Hip Hop, Zydeco, Country, Rthyhm and Blues and very little Jazz. Just take the most famous Frank Zappa quote, "Jazz isn't dead it just smells funny". I'm no more Elitist than any kid who listens to virtually any kind of music. They all think their opinon is right and so do you. I never checked for Brendel, but they sure as hell have Horowitz or Rubinstein and definatly Herbert Von Karajan even Leonard Bernstein. Leonard Berstein was the poppiest "**" around when it came out. As for the Second grade comment, and you claiming to be an English major, you know it sounded incredible racist rather than your actual point. I seriously thought it was a slur against African Americans, but I guess you just didn't get that, that was what it implied.

11-07-2007, 12:35 PM
Urban Hatemonger Groovy Hate F*ck Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Nuuk , Greenland Posts: 8,983	I thought it was a slur against stupid people myself. __________________

11-07-2007, 02:40 PM
davidMC1982 Music Addict Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Sussex, UK Posts: 78	Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it classical music that uses syncopation to create dissonance, whereas in jazz it is the norm? Furthermore, isn't that irrelevant when considering the "worthiness" of a particular style of music? Syncopation is no more a difficult concept than any other element of musical theory. This apparent snobbery, found particularly in the followers of jazz and classical music, is no different to the blind fanaticism shown by followers of all other genres and in some cases, particular artists. Truth be known, good music is good music irrespective of genre. To disregard an entire genre due to nothing but prejudice (to pre-judge) is one and the same as putting a specific genre on a pedestal. To do so implies a closed mind; one which cannot truly be enjoying music for what it is, since enjoyable music can be found everywhere. Now to the point of the thread, which seems to be asking why a particular store did not stock Dave Brubeck's Take Five. Could it not be that the album in question is so popular the store had simply sold out? The secondary point, is jazz music dying, is quite obviously nonsense. Jazz is dying no more so than classical, rock, blues and any other genre you care to mention. The majority of available music will be whatever is popular at any given time and the rest will be the best of what came before. Dave