The Purity Myth

[TumorAttitude]

The cover is kinda creepy.
I'm sort of dying to read this. Anyone else?

[asshat]

Who wrote it?

[TumorAttitude]

Jessica Valenti of feministing.com

[asshat]

.....the "purity" is virginity?...just because I saw the blooming flower and the non-blooming one...and I read about it on amazon...it sounds like an interesting read, like a lot of feminist books it probably has a lot of valid points that I'd feel like kind of a douche bringing because I'm not a female.

[TumorAttitude]

Asshat, please share your thoughts. You have an honorary vagina for the day.

[asshat]

...ha...I feel honoured.

I haven't actually read the book, so I'm probably gonna be way off on this. It just reminds of the way statutory rape is dealt with differently for male and females. I'm just thinking of a few specific cases where high schools males slept with their teachers. Even though they were legally obliged to prosecute the female teachers, there was an undercurrent of "thata boy!!" and admiration for the kid that scored with an older woman.(I remember reading that the police officer actually congratulated the kid in this one article).

....females the same age on the other hand are usually treated as sacred "virgins" with absolutely no sexual autonomy or free will of their own. I remember there was this creepy 28 year old guy that used to loiter at my workplace, and I found out later that he lured 16 year old girls on the internet for sex. In the article I read he disclosed his actual age to these girls, and then they met up later for (consensual) sex.

...my intitial reaction like a lot of people was that this guy should be locked away for at least 6 years.....but I think back to those sex scandals involving high school males and older teachers....and I can kind of understand how the prosecution was a little lax in that case...I can honestly say that if I was in the same situation(the kids) I wouldn't be traumatized--unless of course I got caught, and had to deal with all the publicity and legal hassles....and I still wouldn't want to see the older lady get locked up.

....so the dude is known as the "guy that scored with the older chick", and the girl(know matter what her personal feelings on the subject are) is treated as the victim and has to deal with the stigma for the rest of her life.
Even super right-wing guys I know who think the male sex offender should be given minimum ten year sentences, argue that the "kid knew what he was doing" in the case of the male victims.

...I'm not trying to excuse sex offenders, and I think in both cases it's unethical and really creepy, but how is the girl any less capable of making the decision that the male did?The dude gets the unofficial "badge of honour", and the girl is now "impure".

[mr dave]

Originally Posted by asshat

...ha...I feel honoured.

I haven't actually read the book, so I'm probably gonna be way off on this. It just reminds of the way statutory rape is dealt with differently for male and females. I'm just thinking of a few specific cases where high schools males slept with their teachers. Even though they were legally obliged to prosecute the female teachers, there was an undercurrent of "thata boy!!" and admiration for the kid that scored with an older woman.(I remember reading that the police officer actually congratulated the kid in this one article).

i haven't read the book either but i have to comment on this specific part.

the blatant double standard in western society when it comes to statutory rape is appalling. we had the perfect example of this happen in my local area around 2006.

case 1 - a 28 year old female teacher brings a 13 year old male student from her class to her brother's apartment. gets the student drunk, then has a bunch of sex. she originally met him in elementary school.

case 2 - a 33 year old male teacher has a relationship with a 17 year old student who is no longer in his class. he only met her in high school


age of consent is 16.


one of these cases resulted in house arrest, the other in a jail sentence. do i really need to specify who got what sentence?

[asshat]

Originally Posted by mr dave

i haven't read the book either but i have to comment on this specific part.

the blatant double standard in western society when it comes to statutory rape is appalling. we had the perfect example of this happen in my local area around 2006.

case 1 - a 28 year old female teacher brings a 13 year old male student from her class to her brother's apartment. gets the student drunk, then has a bunch of sex. she originally met him in elementary school.

case 2 - a 33 year old male teacher has a relationship with a 17 year old student who is no longer in his class. he only met her in high school


age of consent is 16.


one of these cases resulted in house arrest, the other in a jail sentence. do i really need to specify who got what sentence?

It is a double standard in sentencing that I think men are just as guilty in supporting. I'm not saying older men getting involved with 16 year old girls is a good thing. But it's assumed that it's non-consensual from the get-go. A teenage girl may have just made a bad mistake, but in addition to dealing with that she has to go through a humiliating legal ordeal that becomes known to everyone in her school and she gets called a slut and a whore. I think the way they approach statutory law for male victims is a more rational approach for the female victims.(Other than glorifying the men as "super-studs").

....it might be more societal attitudes than the legal system itself....if statutory law depends on the victim identifying themselves as "victims"...I don't think there's any investigators giving girls high fives for "scoring with an older guy".

[TumorAttitude]

You guys all have excellent points.
The book IS about double standards, but its the double standard that girls are encouraged to "stay pure" and slutshamed if they don't. My local bookstore doesn't carry it, so I'ma have to wait for Amazon to ship it.

[mr dave]

Originally Posted by TumorAttitude

You guys all have excellent points.
The book IS about double standards, but its the double standard that girls are encouraged to "stay pure" and slutshamed if they don't. My local bookstore doesn't carry it, so I'ma have to wait for Amazon to ship it.

definitely sounds like an interesting read. although from my perspective i see a lot of guys developing the 'purity' ideal as well. more and more guys don't want to be seen as the desperate guy who banged the town bicycle.

i think the bigger issue stems from the fact that a lot of young people see the loss of their virginity as a physical representation of their ascent into mental maturity and 'adulthood' as opposed to simply being biological maturation.


@ asshat - you're definitely on the mark about the stigma involved in these types of cases. however, in the examples i provided, the female 'victim' was distraught at the idea of being legally prohibited from seeing the teacher. SHE was showing up to court in tears and hoping to stay together.

while i do think it's creepy as hell, and i think the teacher (who was married with 2 kids) was a giant bag of crap. i still think it's blatant sexism when it comes to sentencing. flip the genders in case 1 and tell me there wouldn't be a lynch mob on the hunt for that teacher...