Okkervil River : The Stage Names (lyrics, rock, albums, Genesis)

[Rainard Jalen]

But the music's not dull. It's powerful and evocative. Like Dylan.

[boo boo]

Well theres your problem.

Not a Dylan fan.

[pheurton]

yet a collins fan? =d

[Rainard Jalen]

Originally Posted by boo boo

Well theres your problem.

Not a Dylan fan.

While you are right that the meaningful/semantic content of lyrics has nothing to do with music whatsoever, the vocal delivery and the actual phonetic sound, rhythm/prosody/meter of the words themselves most certainly are, and indeed are no less part of the music than the instruments. With Okkervil River and Dylan etc, the mere sound of the words is crucial to the emotional power of the songs.

[boo boo]

Ok, so what they are doing is admirable, I'll give them that. But I just don't enjoy it, at all. Heck I even like some Leonard Cohen stuff. If you know all it is I like and listen to you would know that my ear is pretty un-discriminating.

But overall I think music comes first, I think the sound of the music is the maker or breaker, not the lyrics, because I'll be honest, I listen to a good deal of music with pretty bad lyrics.

But I do appreciate lyrics as long as I like the music too. If you have a band where both the music and the lyrics speak to me, then thats great, but I don't care how great the lyrics are if I just don't feel the music.

Originally Posted by pheurton

yet a collins fan? =d

Lol. Not his solo stuff. But I am a big fan of Peter Gabriel era Genesis, and I like some of the Collins era stuff, I mean its pop music, you know, the kinda music you like but feel guilty about for some reason.

[sleepy jack]

Originally Posted by boo boo

I did and

A. I think it sounds like bad emo poetry
B. Good lyrics don't make up for really dull music IMO.

Uh, how is it "bad emo poetry"?

[Rainard Jalen]

Originally Posted by Rainard Jalen

While you are right that the meaningful/semantic content of lyrics has nothing to do with music whatsoever, the vocal delivery and the actual phonetic sound, rhythm/prosody/meter of the words themselves most certainly are, and indeed are no less part of the music than the instruments. With Okkervil River and Dylan etc, the mere sound of the words is crucial to the emotional power of the songs.

I actually take that back: there could also be interplay between the meaning of the lyrics and the music itself. The mood, melodies, intervals etc could be designed as if to convey something in the meaning and feeling of the lyrical content.

In that case, lyrics have everything to do with the music, from their meaning to their prosody, rhythm and rhyme. With that in mind, attention to lyrics can be crucial to understanding the ideas behind the instrumentation and so forth. This is definitely true of Okkervil River. The music is much more powerful when understood in light of the lyrics.

[boo boo]

Well I've read some of their lyrics, and when listening to it along with the music it just dosen't add up for me.

And I don't think lyrics are at all important to the quality of the music itself, well ok if the music is really good then good lyrics add to that experience, but its by no means a make or break thing. Thats like saying any music without vocals or lyrics is bad, let alone saying anything with bad lyrics is bad music, regardless of what the music itself actually sounds like.

Okkervil River bores me, and they have no emotional effect on me at all.

This is simply because I feel more of a emotional connection with the music itself than the lyics. I find Sigur Ros's music very moving, and their lyrics are either in Icelandic or just plain gibberish.

Honestly lyrics mean nothing to me if it means complete disregard for the music, this is what I get from Okkervil River, if I have to understand the lyrics in order to appreciate the music (which in all likeliness, I still wouldn't) then it defeats the purpose of music for me, if I listen to an album and I think its bad, then I just do, I shouldn't have to study the damn lyrics and fully analize their meaning in order for my opinion to have any credibility, listening to music is not a goddamn homework assignment.

Lyrics don't redeem music I don't like, this is why I don't like Bob Dylan, yes he really is a great lyricist, theres no denying that, but I don't really enjoy his music. To me if music is secondary to your lyrics, then you're better off just writing poetry.

[adidasss]

I agree about the music coming before lyrics, but really, you expressed your disliking earlier, why bring it up again? Don't mean to be a dick, but it's kinda obnoxious...:\

[boo boo]

Jalen was addressing a comment to me, I have the right ro respond.

And this is afterall a thread asking people what they think of the album, I gave my opinion, we're having a civil discussion here, I'm not trying to start any mudslinging.