Songwriting Tips Thread (lyrics, jazz, metal, genre, Linkin Park)

Voice_of_the_Soul12,13,01 · 10-30-2007, 08:42 PM

YEah, but there's only, what, meh number of words for "darkness," and the same goes for the other things you've said. but I will take to heart with what you just said.

dmackey2 · 12-20-2007, 01:14 AM

So I can't think up words for the life of me. I can get chords and songs down really easy. But the lyrics is what kills me every time. What I do write sounds good for the moment and probably the next five minutes. But it's so unlike what I would really say. My lyrics don't have any character behind them. All of the prose and stuff I've written for classes had a toune-in-cheek sense of humor but I can't seem to get that same effect in lyrics. Any ideas how to get even started on an idea?

Crowe · 12-20-2007, 01:46 AM

Hum. Just... hum. Record your song and start humming something that sounds decent with the music. Once you aren't so worried about the words this putting words to music thing gets a LOT easier. Once you've figured out what you're humming and when, start throwing some words in there - a little at first, just words, then whole ideas... start peicing it together... voila a song. I say voila like it just happens... it doesn't be patient... be patient.

awriterslastresort · 12-26-2007, 01:31 AM

you can also make a recording of JUST the musical "humming" and than as its playing, write stuff down to fit it. my idea is vaguely similar to Crowe's just in another direction of how to do it.

Strap me to the anchor · 01-01-2008, 08:47 PM

I find this process helpful.

1) construct a melody (rhythm + pitch changes equals melody)
2)determine how many syllables you can break the melody into per repetition.
3) use words that fit into the syllable number.
4)for words you want to use that dont have the correct number of syllables, use synonyms. the more obscure, the more artsy sounding. unless theyre just weird sounding.

most helpful hint ever to me:

try to use short words. once you get past two syllables they get hard to work with.

oh, and don't use any cliches

and the more vague you are, the mysterious and creative you sound. haha. metaphors and similies are good things usually.

i generally don't care for narative songs much. there are always exceptions.

Halfa · 01-25-2008, 11:04 PM

its always good to develope your chord progression first, then develop a melody. Once you have both of these then you will want to plan your song accordingly, such as any changes in key, tempo, or whatever. After you've done this, then come up with lyrics.

This may not be what works for you, but it works for me. this way once you're comming to the lyrics u have a framework to work the lyrics into, and other things dont need to change to fit the lyrics.

myyousick? · 03-03-2008, 07:39 PM

i want to see a song that explains why people use words ,. and if people dont understand that i dsont think their opinion really comes from being an expert or a person who understand music,., it is just from what other people think about you becuase you never can know what every one is really thinking,they dont have drawings and words to communicate with that are what we rerally think

Whatsitoosit · 05-02-2008, 01:45 PM

Interesting read this thread is... mostly the first page. I generally don't think about the rules when writing my songs but it's cool to read through what was posted as I agree with most of it. Repeating words for one, actually repeating entire sections in music bugs the hell out of me. With a chorus I understand (as that is the hook) but when an artist/band repeats an entire verse, to me that is just lazy. An example of this is "God Only Knows" by the Beach Boys... beautiful song (one of my fav's) but I wish it had a third verse that wasn't just a copy of the second.

Also, guitar solo's that just follow the melody line irritate me a bit.. but I'm sure there is a thread for that somewhere.

Halfa · 05-03-2008, 05:03 PM

hmmmmm

if ur really into doing it a certain way
you could try to follow common practice rules
or a circle of fifths progression
lol

and i think it can be interesting when a guitar solo follows a melody line, but only when he adds something to it and resolves it differently than the melody does

Whatsitoosit · 05-05-2008, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halfa

hmmmmm

if ur really into doing it a certain way
you could try to follow common practice rules
or a circle of fifths progression
lol

and i think it can be interesting when a guitar solo follows a melody line, but only when he adds something to it and resolves it differently than the melody does

Yes I agree, aspects of the melody showing up in the solo can work wonderfully, but when it's just a carbon copy of the melody (most of the solos on the green Weezer album) it seems very bland to me. I often think this is an easy way out for the guitar player.

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10-30-2007, 08:42 PM
Voice_of_the_Soul12,13,01 #1 Schuldinist. Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 338	YEah, but there's only, what, meh number of words for "darkness," and the same goes for the other things you've said. but I will take to heart with what you just said. __________________ When the day of Judgment comes, no value for human life or blind visions of peace will save you. Your strength or lack of will determine your right to live.

12-20-2007, 01:14 AM
dmackey2 Groupie Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 5	So I can't think up words for the life of me. I can get chords and songs down really easy. But the lyrics is what kills me every time. What I do write sounds good for the moment and probably the next five minutes. But it's so unlike what I would really say. My lyrics don't have any character behind them. All of the prose and stuff I've written for classes had a toune-in-cheek sense of humor but I can't seem to get that same effect in lyrics. Any ideas how to get even started on an idea?

12-20-2007, 01:46 AM
Crowe Music Addict Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chicago/St. Louie Posts: 676	Hum. Just... hum. Record your song and start humming something that sounds decent with the music. Once you aren't so worried about the words this putting words to music thing gets a LOT easier. Once you've figured out what you're humming and when, start throwing some words in there - a little at first, just words, then whole ideas... start peicing it together... voila a song. I say voila like it just happens... it doesn't be patient... be patient. __________________ Hi. I'm Crowe. This is my sig. My love finally resting, A solemn corpse buried in you. My silly experimental band: www.myspace.com/boyfromthestarsmusic

12-26-2007, 01:31 AM
awriterslastresort what WHAT? Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 992	you can also make a recording of JUST the musical "humming" and than as its playing, write stuff down to fit it. my idea is vaguely similar to Crowe's just in another direction of how to do it. __________________ *shield yourself fool*

01-01-2008, 08:47 PM
Strap me to the anchor Groupie Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana, USA Posts: 33	I find this process helpful. 1) construct a melody (rhythm + pitch changes equals melody) 2)determine how many syllables you can break the melody into per repetition. 3) use words that fit into the syllable number. 4)for words you want to use that dont have the correct number of syllables, use synonyms. the more obscure, the more artsy sounding. unless theyre just weird sounding. most helpful hint ever to me: try to use short words. once you get past two syllables they get hard to work with. oh, and don't use any cliches and the more vague you are, the mysterious and creative you sound. haha. metaphors and similies are good things usually. i generally don't care for narative songs much. there are always exceptions.

01-25-2008, 11:04 PM
Halfa Allman Brothers Obsessor Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: The Whipping Post Posts: 130	its always good to develope your chord progression first, then develop a melody. Once you have both of these then you will want to plan your song accordingly, such as any changes in key, tempo, or whatever. After you've done this, then come up with lyrics. This may not be what works for you, but it works for me. this way once you're comming to the lyrics u have a framework to work the lyrics into, and other things dont need to change to fit the lyrics.

03-03-2008, 07:39 PM
myyousick? Groupie Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 2	i want to see a song that explains why people use words ,. and if people dont understand that i dsont think their opinion really comes from being an expert or a person who understand music,., it is just from what other people think about you becuase you never can know what every one is really thinking,they dont have drawings and words to communicate with that are what we rerally think

05-02-2008, 01:45 PM
Whatsitoosit Bringer of Carrots Join Date: May 2008 Location: New York, NY Posts: 234	Interesting read this thread is... mostly the first page. I generally don't think about the rules when writing my songs but it's cool to read through what was posted as I agree with most of it. Repeating words for one, actually repeating entire sections in music bugs the hell out of me. With a chorus I understand (as that is the hook) but when an artist/band repeats an entire verse, to me that is just lazy. An example of this is "God Only Knows" by the Beach Boys... beautiful song (one of my fav's) but I wish it had a third verse that wasn't just a copy of the second. Also, guitar solo's that just follow the melody line irritate me a bit.. but I'm sure there is a thread for that somewhere.

05-03-2008, 05:03 PM
Halfa Allman Brothers Obsessor Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: The Whipping Post Posts: 130	hmmmmm if ur really into doing it a certain way you could try to follow common practice rules or a circle of fifths progression lol and i think it can be interesting when a guitar solo follows a melody line, but only when he adds something to it and resolves it differently than the melody does __________________ "This all should come as no surprise You knew soon one day I would rise Give meat a chance and you will find There’s more to me than meat and eyes" -Early Man