Are We Welcoming Enough To New People?

YorkeDaddy · 04-01-2014, 04:46 PM

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Originally Posted by Vanilla

Sound rather drab to me.

Yeah my life sux

**Scarlett O'Hara** · 04-01-2014, 04:47 PM

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Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Yeah my life sux

Mines good.

Trollheart · 04-01-2014, 04:57 PM

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Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Gee you're right, I'm out to get you specifically which is why I have only argued this with you rather than everybody. You have, however, made it very clear that you don't think noobs should post in Spill Your Guts, which is first of all ridiculous and second of all it actually does suggest that you're trying to specify where noobs can and can't post.

First of all, YOU brought up ROXY's post about that when I asked you to justify the claim that "noobs" were being chased out of threads. I began my contribution to this discussion by saying I used to always welcome noobs but had no lonegr time for it, so why don't they just come on out and have some fun? You then somehow linked mine and Roxy's opinion throughthat quoted post (which YOU quoted), as if we both had the same opinion.

I still stand by my reasoning. The "room full of people you don't know" analogy is very apt. You need to get to know people before you start telling them what you think of them, as I've said twice or more already. This does NOT, repeat NOT mean I do not expect any new members ever to post in SYG: I just think they should wait until they have guts to spill. Be interesting to see how you twist that.

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Additionally, "noobs" is an inherently derogatory word on its own and I despise it. You may notice that I have never and will never use that word unless I'm actually addressing when someone else said it, like in the above paragraph.

This is such a silly pointless comment I ain't gonna even comment. You might as well say rookie or greenhorn are derogatory terms.

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You're right it's not a crime, which is exactly why I said "there's nothing inherently wrong with that" directly after. Anywhere that operates on cliques like this site is unwelcome just by default. This forum is like a high school, it's really difficult for people to fit in, as evidenced by how many new members there are versus how many of those members actually develop friendships and stick around. I don't know what else I should have to say about that.

Completely untrue. You can have cliques that welcome people. That's how they become cliques. It's the people outside the cliques who make themselves feel unwelcome often by not joining in, or feeling put-upon. Another example of your flawed logic.

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Wow damn you got me, my generalization was very accurate but since there are some exceptions I'm just 100% wrong.

When you say "this is irrefutable" you leave zero room for manoeuvering. You're either right or you're wrong. You can't backtrack.

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For god sakes. There are only around twenty regular posters here, and if you go into basically any thread made in the past year, you will see one or multiple of those regulars in the conversation. Feel free to try and find me one exception and I will counter with fifty that prove my point.

I think you'll find there are more than twenty regulars. Check the member list at any time to confirm.

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What do I mean by growth? What kind of question is that? Why on earth would you not want as many members here as possible? We're on a music forum, where we want as many diverse opinions and backgrounds as possible so that we can explore every facet of music. The less members, the less possible places to draw from for more music. Why the hell do I have to explain that?

No, totally wrong. You don't want as many members as possible, all spamming and writing one-line posts. You want people of value who will contribute on their own, people who want to make the place better or want to make themselves valued. As I've been saying, be the change. Nobody's going to create an environment you can just drop into and feel comfortable right away. You need to work to make that happen, you need to be part of the community. You can't expect people to build Paradise for you while you sit out on the steps and have a smoke.I'd rather have twenty good, contributing, non-squabbling, knowledgeable and pleasant members than a hundred who are mostly useless and only here to troll or promote themselves in some way.

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Well this just suggests that you're not invested in this discussion enough to spend 10 seconds finding this answer. The member in question's name is Kartoffelbrei. Said member was extremely rudely chased off by a regular here, and you seemed to defend that, which is why I very reasonably assumed some things about your stance. I apologize, but chill the **** out. You're the one with the stance that comes off as intolerable, not me. I'm well aware that you're not actually intolerable, but the fact that you're trying to argue this with me so vehemently is really confusing to me and I have no idea why you would disagree, frankly.

I have been PM-ing with Kart and I know why he left, but I didn't see you mentioning him. If you did my apologies but you did not mention it in your later posts to me.

You've also conveniently ignored the point about the journals, which you brought up, god knows why as it has nothing to do with people being accepted. I'd like to hear your logic on how that fits in?

One more time though: no matter how much you want me to be, I am NOT opposed to noobs (and I'll keep saying it because I don't believe anyone else finds it in the least offensive: some people start their intro thread with "Hi! Noob here!") joining in or creating threads. I think that's the best way to integrate yourself into the forum and learn who's who. I advocate waiting to post in SYG until you know people, that's all. I don't think that's a mind-alteringly radical stance to take. And I think a lot of people here agree with that. Some don't and that's fine, everyone is entitled to their opinion. But you will not make me out to be some sort of noob-hater because I am not. I was a noob once, so were you. Why would I hate them or want to make them uncomfortable?

YorkeDaddy · 04-01-2014, 05:11 PM

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Originally Posted by Trollheart

No, totally wrong. You don't want as many members as possible, all spamming and writing one-line posts. You want people of value who will contribute on their own, people who want to make the place better or want to make themselves valued. As I've been saying, be the change. Nobody's going to create an environment you can just drop into and feel comfortable right away. You need to work to make that happen, you need to be part of the community. You can't expect people to build Paradise for you while you sit out on the steps and have a smoke.I'd rather have twenty good, contributing, non-squabbling, knowledgeable and pleasant members than a hundred who are mostly useless and only here to troll or promote themselves in some way.

Does "we want as many diverse opinions and backgrounds as possible so that we can explore every facet of music" not suggest that I'm talking about members that actually contribute, not people that are "spamming and writing one-line posts". You say I misinterpret your posts, and then you turn it around and severely misinterpret mine. I mean jesus the hypocrisy.

It's pretty rare that I'm just completely incapable of seeing where someone is coming from, but I am clearly just so far on the other side of the coin on this issue. You can say you're "not opposed to noobs" all day but you clearly just see them in a much different way than the rest of the members here solely because they haven't been registered as long. I mean, how many people do you know that have tried to fit in here and couldn't or was turned off by the site? Because I know a few, and that's what I'm basing this on, along with the scenario where Roxy basically lynched Kart for no reason, which is something you're defending. That's just not how I think people should be treated, so you can keep having your ideologies and I'll keep on thinking the way I think and that's pretty much the last that can be said on the manner.

Just so everyone knows, I still think I'm right, and I don't know how too much tolerance could ever be perceived as a bad thing, but it'll all be okay in the end because I'm just here to fuck around at this point. Strive for glory etc.

The disappointing part is that if a week ago someone told me Trollheart would disagree with me on this matter, I would've laughed because I never would've thought that.

Carpe Mortem · 04-01-2014, 05:16 PM

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Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Well this is basically my stance so thank you for agreeing!

You have a very, very "idgaf" sort of attitude, don't you?

Yeah, in real life too. I'm a sociopathic nihilist of sorts, but in the happiest, good time havin, benevolent way possible! Hence my user title.

Neapolitan · 04-01-2014, 05:18 PM

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Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

The disappointing part is that if a week ago someone told me Trollheart would disagree with me on this matter, I would've laughed because I never would've thought that.

If a month ago someone told me Trollheart didn't like ABACAB I would've laughed because I never would've thought that.

YorkeDaddy · 04-01-2014, 05:19 PM

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Originally Posted by Neapolitan

If a month ago someone told me Trollheart didn't like ABACAB I would've laughed because I never would've thought that.

Well he's just surprising everybody left and right, isn't he?

Neapolitan · 04-01-2014, 05:27 PM

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Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Well he's just surprising everybody left and right, isn't he?

Yes because Abacab was a good album.

Freebase Dali · 04-01-2014, 05:34 PM

My current perspective is this:

- Have basic rules that keep the place from spiraling into a madhouse.
- Now leave it the f*ck alone and let nature do the rest.

If we have to coddle and hand-hold people to stay here, they're not worth being here. Let 'em be adults and choose to f*ck off as they wish. This is a self-sustaining system. It requires very little maintenance if people don't shove sh*t in the gears. Why make this more difficult than it needs to be? We're not trying to create a f*cking utopia here. We're just here to talk to people we like about sh*t we like and that's it.

As for the "noob" thing...
Sure, let's legislate something into the rules that denies the use of an expression based on the assumption that everyone is affected by it in the same way a few are... Next, we can ban people for saggy pants and showing their underwear. What is this, Louisiana? Gtfo.

YorkeDaddy · 04-01-2014, 05:38 PM

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Originally Posted by Freebase Dali

As for the "noob" thing...
Sure, let's legislate something into the rules that denies the use of an expression based on the assumption that everyone is affected by it in the same way a few are... Next, we can ban people for saggy pants and showing their underwear. What is this, Louisiana? Gtfo.

This is the furthest thing from what I was getting at. I think it's a silly word, so I don't use it. I was actually describing why I feel that way because of my different background, and I acknowledged that people here see the word differently which is understandable. I have no idea what the basis for the above paragraph was.

04-01-2014, 05:34 PM	#209 (permalink)
Freebase Dali Partying on the inside Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,584	My current perspective is this: - Have basic rules that keep the place from spiraling into a madhouse. - Now leave it the fck alone and let nature do the rest. If we have to coddle and hand-hold people to stay here, they're not worth being here. Let 'em be adults and choose to fck off as they wish. This is a self-sustaining system. It requires very little maintenance if people don't shove sht in the gears. Why make this more difficult than it needs to be? We're not trying to create a fcking utopia here. We're just here to talk to people we like about sh*t we like and that's it. As for the "noob" thing... Sure, let's legislate something into the rules that denies the use of an expression based on the assumption that everyone is affected by it in the same way a few are... Next, we can ban people for saggy pants and showing their underwear. What is this, Louisiana? Gtfo. __________________