The Wow I Can't Believe That News Story Thread - Music Banter Music Banter

Go Back   Music Banter > Community Center > The Lounge > Current Events, Philosophy, & Religion
Register Blogging Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Welcome to Music Banter Forum! Make sure to register - it's free and very quick! You have to register before you can post and participate in our discussions with over 70,000 other registered members. After you create your free account, you will be able to customize many options, you will have the full access to over 1,100,000 posts.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-21-2019, 07:19 PM   #18341 (permalink)
one-balled nipple jockey
 
OccultHawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dirty Souf Biatch
Posts: 22,033
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frownland View Post
Which ones have you considered?
There aren’t any.
__________________

2016 2017 2018 2019 2020

Member of the Year & Journal of the Year Champion

Behold the Writing of THE LEGEND:

https://www.musicbanter.com/members-...p-lighter.html

OccultHawk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:20 PM   #18342 (permalink)
SOPHIE FOREVER
 
Frownland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: East of the Southern North American West
Posts: 35,548
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OccultHawk View Post
I can't think of any.
Try harder.
__________________
Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Frownland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:22 PM   #18343 (permalink)
jwb
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,403
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug McClasky View Post
Sure but that doesn't mean that a fundamental change in how we live, how we think, and how we interact hasn't occurred that makes comparisons to older times at best problematic and at most completely useless. Hunting mammoths literally isn't the same as working a desk job or laying asphalt.
my point was simply that labor isn't some unnatural invention of capitalism. It's been baked into our existence from the start. It's just in our society it's more indirect in terms of how it relates to the resources we procur. But the bottom line is you don't get something for nothing. Your existence has a material cost. You're responsible for paying it.


Quote:
Modern society has fundamentally changed the idea of a hunter gatherer model...
don't quite understand this statement


Quote:
I prefer this society because I have been trained for nothing else than living in it. If you chucked me into a Viking war band I wouldn't be opposed simply because of modern Liberal values conflicting with Viking values, I'd be opposed cause HOLY ****ING **** I WAS NOT TRAINED TO LIVE THIS LIFE GET ME OFF THIS BOAT!!!
The hunter gatherer bit was tongue in cheek.

You weren't born trained to work at Burger King. And working on an agrarian farm in a commune would certainly involve a learning curve. But you could manage it, if you were so
inclined.
jwb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:23 PM   #18344 (permalink)
one-balled nipple jockey
 
OccultHawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dirty Souf Biatch
Posts: 22,033
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frownland View Post
I agree.
You should because it’s true.
__________________

2016 2017 2018 2019 2020

Member of the Year & Journal of the Year Champion

Behold the Writing of THE LEGEND:

https://www.musicbanter.com/members-...p-lighter.html

OccultHawk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:24 PM   #18345 (permalink)
jwb
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,403
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OccultHawk View Post
America makes all other alternatives impossible. Capitalism is a global menace that leaves no space uninvaded - physical and psychological.

Do you always argue for the most banal and widely accepted perspective?
do you always go against the grain without any regard for pragmatism or reality?

I'm actually quite cynical about the long term prospects of capitalism. But I'm just more cynical about anarchism.

And despite your cop out, there are anarcho communes in the United States. Yes the
communes have to pay taxes etc. But effectively you live off the products you make in a close knit environment. It's literally the closest thing to what you say you want to live under. What exactly is stopping you?

Last edited by jwb; 07-21-2019 at 07:29 PM.
jwb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:26 PM   #18346 (permalink)
one-balled nipple jockey
 
OccultHawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dirty Souf Biatch
Posts: 22,033
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jwb View Post
my point was simply that labor isn't some unnatural invention of capitalism. It's been baked into our existence from the start. It's just in our society it's more indirect in terms of how it relates to the resources we procur. But the bottom line is you don't get something for nothing. Your existence has a material cost. You're responsible for paying it.


don't quite understand this statement



The hunter gatherer bit was tongue in cheek.

You weren't born trained to work at Burger King. And working on an agrarian farm in a commune would certainly involve a learning curve. But you could manage it, if you were so
inclined.
America doesn’t allow it. If the farmland is fertile it always feeds the capitalist model. And yes, I mean without exception.
__________________

2016 2017 2018 2019 2020

Member of the Year & Journal of the Year Champion

Behold the Writing of THE LEGEND:

https://www.musicbanter.com/members-...p-lighter.html

OccultHawk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:34 PM   #18347 (permalink)
jwb
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,403
Default

The communes already exist. People are living in them. They are making enough to live off. They pay taxes, yes. So do you. Stop copping out
Why don't you join?

Just say you can't give up your privileged life to live on a farm and I'll understand.
jwb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:34 PM   #18348 (permalink)
Zum Henker Defätist!!
 
The Batlord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Beating GNR at DDR and keying Axl's new car
Posts: 48,216
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jwb View Post
my point was simply that labor isn't some unnatural invention of capitalism. It's been baked into our existence from the start. It's just in our society it's more indirect in terms of how it relates to the resources we procur. But the bottom line is you don't get something for nothing. Your existence has a material cost. You're responsible for paying it.
And my point is that how modern society relates to the basic concept of not getting something for nothing has changed over the millenia and become far more complex and nuanced, so bringing up older times has the effect of oversimplifying modern realities.


Quote:
don't quite understand this statement
It was meant to lead into my next statement to your next statement. Hence the ellipsis. Expounding would have meant repeating myself.

Quote:
You weren't born trained to work at Burger King.
I was born trained to live in a society where Burger King and all the rest of American capitalism is the monolithic norm.

Quote:
And working on an agrarian farm in a commune would certainly involve a learning curve. But you could manage it, if you were so
inclined.
Being inclined isn't the point. Find me an agrarian commune and I'll go there and see what happens. You can't simply shake a stick and find one, let alone a functioning one. Modern capitalistic society makes agrarian communes not simply rare but different from how they would be in a socialist society because the people who would go out of their way to create such a commune are going to be a very specific type of person and there's no guarantee that that person will be the person needed to create such a commune, and even if they were I've been raised to treat such a concept in a certain dubious way that makes me distrustful of any commune I might find. And that says nothing of how modern laws might affect how a commune should have to operate that would undermine its sustainability since those laws do not exist to sustain communes but to sustain capitalist ventures.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien
There is only one bright spot and that is the growing habit of disgruntled men of dynamiting factories and power-stations; I hope that, encouraged now as ‘patriotism’, may remain a habit! But it won’t do any good, if it is not universal.
The Batlord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:39 PM   #18349 (permalink)
Zum Henker Defätist!!
 
The Batlord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Beating GNR at DDR and keying Axl's new car
Posts: 48,216
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jwb View Post
The communes already exist. People are living in them. They are making enough to live off. They pay taxes, yes. So do you. Stop copping out
Why don't you join?

Just say you can't give up your privileged life to live on a farm and I'll understand.
I think you're making the assumption that modern Liberal capitalism allows for all forms of habitation equally. I've looked up communes. They're few, far between, and generally don't seem to exist for long. The reasons for this are debatable of course but the idea that I could just Google "communes near me" and just start my new life is silly.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien
There is only one bright spot and that is the growing habit of disgruntled men of dynamiting factories and power-stations; I hope that, encouraged now as ‘patriotism’, may remain a habit! But it won’t do any good, if it is not universal.
The Batlord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 07:40 PM   #18350 (permalink)
jwb
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,403
Default

Pretty sure I was watching a video about one in Virgina not too long ago. I think they're definitely out there.

And yes it takes a specific kind of person. Namely one who walks the walk.
jwb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads



© 2003-2024 Advameg, Inc.