Meph1986

Dammit.....

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lucifer_sam

The pledge of allegiance is one of the last things I would be concerned about with separation of church and state. It's a two word appositive in a pledge you don't even have to say. Not really a pressing issue, imo. What needs to be rectified is the double standard which Congress lives by. Politicians will decry separation of church and state when they need to use religion to rationalize their policy (for abortion, stem-cell research, *** rights etc).

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sleepy jack

I don't really understand what you're getting at. The pledge of allegiance is said more than babies are aborted. Seriously it's the apex of my post and it's a symbolic gesture. To truly have separation of church and state we must remove under god. It's the only way.

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lucifer_sam

Your posts reach a climax? Dear me, my literary skills are poorer than I thought.

I'm sorry, I don't see "under God" as a huge issue here (no more than "In God we trust"). While it is regrettable that those little words exist in the first place, there are far more pressing problems in the education system (especially in view of these recent law upheavals about separation of church and state). It really doesn't matter how often those words are said, because they don't offer a lasting impact upon the education of a child (no more than "In God we trust" does for the rest of the population). I understand the symbolic importance, but it still seems like an inconsequential target.

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sleepy jack

You clearly don't understand what symbolism can do. It can inspire and it can destroy. By putting In God We Trust on our currency and reciting Under God at all major events you're setting a standard. A standard which government and policies will follow with as long as you allow it to continue. They're making it sound like Manifest Destiny is still with us today. Once you remove Under God, gay marriage, abortion laws, education reform, etc will follow suit and stop being an issue. Words are the most powerful thing in the world. You would do well to learn this.

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lucifer_sam

Wow, you sure are a benevolent and wise seventeen-year-old.

Don't you think you're oversimplifying this a bit? These issues have been issues for the last thirty years - abortion has come up every year in the platforms since Roe v. Wade happened, thirty-five years ago. A token phrase elimination isn't going to completely change the American population's stance towards these issues. These things take time. The Civil Rights Act was created almost forty years ago and reparations have yet to trickle down to impoverished minorities. What makes these issues so simple to resolve?

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sleepy jack

We weren't saying "one white nation" during the civil rights movement. Also we added Under God to the pledge of allegiance in the fifties. Rove v. Wade happened after that. Not a coincidence, learn to connect the dots.

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lucifer_sam

Laws against abortion were rendered unconstitutional because they added "under God" to the pledge of allegiance?

Gotcha.

(Just a question, but do you understand what Roe v. Wade was? I think you should read about it before you argue about it.)

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sleepy jack

You're grossly misunderstanding my point. Perhaps you really do need to brush up on your literary skills.

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lucifer_sam

Awesome. Will do.

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