What's The Latest Film You Have Seen?

The Batlord · 10-19-2019, 06:29 PM

And of course throw in the isolation of modern social media and internet culture into the mix and the cultural chimera could never be imagined and **** knows how many other ingredients I'm missing.

**Frownland** · 10-19-2019, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Were they? I don't know. But I'm not even spearheading them as emblematic of the problem so much as one more symptom. I mean bullying has existed throughout human culture presumably for as long as human culture has existed. The confusion of what it means to be male in society now has confused many as to how they should even act without any real alternative, the loss of the "American dream" through late stage capitalist decay has robbed the youth of what they were raised to believe they were capable of, American consumerism has conditioned the public to see themselves not as human beings but as inhuman digits on a pie chart for advertising firms. Humanity itself is simply a degraded simulacrum of what it once believed it was when even that was a simulacrum of something that it never understood in the first place.

Throw the "common" degradation of being treated as a loser into the mix without proper mental health support and we're reaping what we've sowed.

Definitely. Maybe the film being set in what seemed to be the 80s is a way of pointing at corporate capitalism as one of many causes of the character's mindset.

**Frownland** · 10-19-2019, 06:42 PM

Spoiler for one more thing:

The Batlord · 10-19-2019, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Definitely. Maybe the film being set in what seemed to be the 80s is a way of pointing at corporate capitalism as one of many causes of the character's mindset.

JOKER SPOILERS

I'd say the yuppie victims of the Joker's first murders would support that. Don't forget that Bruce Wayne's father in Batman comics has always been portrayed as a paragon of virtue, and this movie's portrayal of him as an arrogant 1%er decrying wealth envy subverts not only Batman lore but American lore as well.

**Frownland** · 10-19-2019, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

JOKER SPOILERS

I'd say the yuppie victims of the Joker's first murders would support that. Don't forget that Bruce Wayne's father in Batman comics has always been portrayed as a paragon of virtue, and this movie's portrayal of him as an arrogant 1%er decrying wealth envy subverts not only Batman lore but American lore as well.

From what I understand, Batman is told from Bruce Wayne's perspective, so there could be an element of trauma-driven idealism at play in that depiction.

The Batlord · 10-19-2019, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Spoiler for one more thing:

Spoiler for spoilers:

The Batlord · 10-19-2019, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

From what I understand, Batman is told from Bruce Wayne's perspective, so there could be an element of trauma-driven idealism at play in that depiction.

Well of course but that doesn't really affect my point.

**Frownland** · 10-19-2019, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Spoiler for spoilers:

Spoiler for .:

The Batlord · 10-19-2019, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Spoiler for .:

But there was no alternative to the Joker's end result. There was no, "He's wrong and here's why and here's what we can do if we do something better". The whole city just sided with the Joker because they saw no alternative to fight the Wayne oligarchy and they didn't even seek an alternative. Violence was the solution point blank no question.

The end result of the movie sided with the Joker, and if the end result wasn't pretty it wasn't because the movie was seeking for a more palatable solution, it was because it was a movie that was spreading its evil batwings to side with the villain and not give the audience any alternative. This was a ****ing villain movie. It doesn't exist to exist within the greater hero universe, it exists to raise up the villain. That's why it's so ugly and seedy and unpleasant. It doesn't even necessarily reflect the director's viewpoint, it reflects the Joker's viewpoint. The movie ends with raising the Joker up as the hero regardless of whether or not that's the viewpoint of the people who made the movie.

**Frownland** · 10-19-2019, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

But there was no alternative to the Joker's end result. There was no, "He's wrong and here's why and here's what we can do if we do something better". The whole city just sided with the Joker because they saw no alternative to fight the Wayne oligarchy and they didn't even seek an alternative. Violence was the solution point blank no question.

The end result of the movie sided with the Joker, and if the end result wasn't pretty it wasn't because the movie was seeking for a more palatable solution, it was because it was a movie that was spreading its evil batwings to side with the villain and not give the audience any alternative. This was a ****ing villain movie. It doesn't exist to exist within the greater hero universe, it exists to raise up the villain. That's why it's so ugly and seedy and unpleasant. It doesn't even necessarily reflect the director's viewpoint, it reflects the Joker's viewpoint. The movie ends with raising the Joker up as the hero regardless of whether or not that's the viewpoint of the people who made the movie.

"Whatever the **** you think I said is not what I said"
-Bill Burr

Big mood. I agree with your post.

10-19-2019, 06:42 PM	#23083 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,548	Spoiler for one more thing: One thing that I thought was pretty interesting about the ending was that even though he had confronted all of these very valid social ills, the only result was chaos. I'm fairly certain that this is setting up a sequel, so I wonder if that will churn out a decent foil to this character that has the same enemies but aims for better results or something along those lines. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x