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**Frownland** · 03-07-2017, 08:10 AM

Twinsies

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djchameleon · 03-07-2017, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riseagainstrocks

Hey, no one is saying they can't. I might find it weird, but I'm perfectly happy to let people express themselves as they wish.

I've noticed some overlap between that group and people pushing bathrooms-by-birth-sex laws and a general intolerance of so-called "deviant" behavior (seriously, just spend some time poking around the these facebook groups). The cognitive dissonance is interesting to me. People embracing their own "deviant" behavior, the fetishizing of a drawing, but seeking some form of control over what they view as aberrant.

I noticed the overlap as well around the time that Gamergate happened. There was an anime looking girl called Vivian that was constantly being referred to and people posting pictures of her but I never bothered to research the origins of Vivian.

**Frownland** · 03-07-2017, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goofle

3. You're explaining a problem that simply can't be solved through "justice" of any kind. Play out any scenario where we have to transfer justice by force in your head:

So you're going to make Whites (and Asians I guess?) pay a Black Tax? That'll go down well. Way to stoke racial tension, make Black people feel more oppressed and victimized etc.

Quote:

So we are going to make it easier for Black people to get into college and University even if they have worse grades and take the place of a more suitable student? That went down well. And this could extend to hiring policies.

You are pointing to the issue that affirmative action attempts to solve as the reason that affirmative action doesn't work lol. Plus I'm sure you know that you're strawmanning the concept by defining it by slippery slope scenarios that are so far outside the norm that they're essentially nonexistent.

Lastly, as I'm sure you've picked up on here, stupid people will bitch about anything and blame their problems on anyone but themselves, so that discrimination article doesn't really hold that much weight either.

djchameleon · 03-07-2017, 09:26 AM

There is also the issue of pointing to one case to show that the entire policy is flawed. Overall the policy general does more good than harm with a few outlier cases.

**Goofle** · 03-07-2017, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

You are pointing to the issue that affirmative action attempts to solve as the reason that affirmative action doesn't work lol. Plus I'm sure you know that you're strawmanning the concept by defining it by slippery slope scenarios that are so far outside the norm that they're essentially nonexistent.

I was spit-balling a few hypothetical scenarios. I'd like to hear a great way in which we could enforce equality of outcome, but there definitely isn't one.

But yeah, I agree. People will blame anyone other than themselves for their failings. Either individually or as a community. Hence my whole stance against affirmative action in the first place. But at least there's a good reason to complain if you're being discriminated against due to affirmative action.

**Frownland** · 03-07-2017, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goofle

if you're being discriminated against due to affirmative action.

Evidence of this por favor. Or define discrimination because I see a lot of delusional people who simply proclaim that they're too wonderful to not admit into a school. The admission process runs through a lot more than SAT scores. If their victim complex falls under the umbrella then sure I agree with this statement.

**Goofle** · 03-09-2017, 01:41 AM

https://www.princeton.edu/~tje/files...Dec%202004.pdf

This is the only source I could find. I don't think they are really "collecting" data on it.

DwnWthVwls · 03-09-2017, 11:44 AM

I get your point, but I don't think losing a job to affirmative action is discriminatory as much as it is the result of a shitty system that had to be put into place because of actual discrimination.

**Frownland** · 03-09-2017, 11:58 AM

The most effective approach to affirmative action in my mind is maintaining a diverse admissions boards as well as in the groups that develop admissions standards.

I do think that affirmative action as most people understand it (student quotas) has its merits because of how different the opportunists between people can be. A student in a poorer neighborhood with the same SAT score as someone from a more upscale neighbourhood may not have the same extracurricular activities available to them that would put the latter student over the edge in the admissions process.

It's never perfect and could always be honed down though. Sometimes people are denied for the most fickle reasons, like having a boring but good writing style or just not seeming like a good fit for the school's culture (another good reason why a diverse board is a good idea: it keeps schools from becoming the [x] club).

DwnWthVwls · 03-09-2017, 06:18 PM

I hate that argument tbh. Just because one group has more privilege than another does not invalidate discrimination against the more fortunate group. This goes for everything class, race, gender, etc. It may change priority but not significance.

03-07-2017, 08:10 AM	#121 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,548	Twinsies . __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x

03-09-2017, 11:58 AM	#129 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,548	The most effective approach to affirmative action in my mind is maintaining a diverse admissions boards as well as in the groups that develop admissions standards. I do think that affirmative action as most people understand it (student quotas) has its merits because of how different the opportunists between people can be. A student in a poorer neighborhood with the same SAT score as someone from a more upscale neighbourhood may not have the same extracurricular activities available to them that would put the latter student over the edge in the admissions process. It's never perfect and could always be honed down though. Sometimes people are denied for the most fickle reasons, like having a boring but good writing style or just not seeming like a good fit for the school's culture (another good reason why a diverse board is a good idea: it keeps schools from becoming the [x] club). __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x