Quote:
Originally Posted by Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra
How can you 'pioneer' lyrics? You're missing the point with the Guthrie comparison. My point is, Dylan just fit with the times. He was not better, or worse, and nowhere near as pioneering. And Guthrie got everything he did from Leadbelly(Whom he lived with many years studying from, Dylan would later study Guthrie):
/\ 1942. Then again, being a black man in the 40s doing protest songs doesn't have the same appeal as a scruffy haired young white man in the 60s doing protest songs, does it?
Then again, this style of music dates back to the freaking civil war:
Civil War Music: The Rebel Soldier
Both sides made songs like things, and from what I can tell, there some that date back even to the Mexican American war, and earlier.
Dylan was not doing anything new, really...
Just a vanity project to somebody who probably had a boyhood fantasy, and wanted to shock intellectuals all the time. Sometimes highly educated people have self indulgent vanity projects. May I refer you to a book I read just recently called 'Michelle Remembers' written by a credited psychatrist who tried to convince me that a five year old girl was kidnapped by a rape cult that would crawl on 4 legs, and tear cats to pieces with their teeth, transform people into devils, etc.
This is a suitable answer. I can't disagree. Not filled with ridiculous hyperbole like Dylan being the sole harbinger of intellect in rock n' roll.
Dylan shouldn't even be accredited for being an inventor when he was obviously more a preserver. I honestly think he was a regressive preserver more than a progressive reserver, anyway. Again, I think the advantage of Bob Dylan was, as mentioned before with the 60s comment, time and place. |
Yes folk music had been around for a long time. But Dylan did put it on the map, he popularized it more than any other folk artist before him and he is responsible for the development of folk rock.
Really, It was just a childhood fascination? How do you figure? Considering that Professor Christopher Ricks was born 8 years before Bob Dylan, I think it was more than a childhood fascination. You think the professor of poetry at Oxford University knows a little more about poetry than you do? Maybe, just maybe.
I did not say that Dylan pioneered lyrics. I said He pioneered depth in song lyrics by adding the intellectualism of classic literature and poetry. I dont think you seem to understand that protest songs made up only a small fraction of his career. He was tired of writing them after a few years. He went in a different direction after that and that is when he became really unique. Its pretty obvious that Dylan was on another level of writing than Woody Guthrie was. It is evident when you compare their lyrics. Dylan was much more poetic. Everything you say leads me to believe that you know very little about Dylans music. Listen to Rock n roll before Dylan and then listen to it after him. There is no way you can tell me that you cant see a difference. There wasnt any rock n roll that sounded anything like the rock n roll that Dylan was making. His unique sound was obvious. He unquestionably added lyrical depth and intelligence to the music. If he didnt, tell me who did.
"The thing about rock'n'roll is that for me anyway it wasn't enough ... There were great catch-phrases and driving pulse rhythms ... but the songs weren't serious or didn't reflect life in a realistic way. I knew that when I got into folk music, it was more of a serious type of thing. The songs are filled with more despair, more sadness, more triumph, more faith in the supernatural, much deeper feelings." - Bob Dylan
I think that is pretty accurate.
You continue to think that Dylans entire career was just a rip off of Woody Guthrie. Dylans music was based on traditional folk for only around 4 years. He went electric in 1965. It was becoming clear as soon as 1963 when he released
The freewheelin Bob Dylan that he was moving away from protest songs with songs such as
Girl from the North country. And then by the release of
Another side of Bob Dylan in 1964, it was evident that he was done with the protest songs. So, really, Dylan stuck to the traditional folk sound for only around 3 years.
George Harrison speaks about Dylans album
The Freewheelin Bob Dylan:
"We just played it, just wore it out. The content of the song lyrics and just the attitude—it was incredibly original and wonderful."
Let me throw out some more musicians that covered Dylan songs and were influenced by him.
The Animals, The Band, The Beach Boys, Jeff Beck, The Black crowes, The Byrds, Johnny Cash, Nick Cave, Eric Clapton, Duke Ellington, The Flying Burrito Brothers, The Grateful Dead, Jimi Hendrix, The Beatles, Neil Young.
The list goes on. I suppose none of these people know anything about music or have the ability to recognize good music.