Quote:
Originally Posted by Mankycaaant
I see what you're saying SR, but it's unfair to compare them in terms of production. Biggie obviously had more backing than L in terms of who worked with him and financially as Diddy was bankrolling him. He had acclaimed producers on hand such as DJ Premier and RZA to handle his beats. Besides Biggie had no say whatsoever in his production so it's not exactly fair to hold that against L (who didn't produce either)
L depended less on the beats as they played second fiddle to his words and let his rhymes take focus, which I believe should be the case in hip-hop.
As for versatility, Biggie was being pushed as a club rapper at times as Diddy tried to squeeze money out of his increasing popularity as well as them trying to push the whole 'thug' persona. L didn't have a plethora of gimmicks, he just kept to what he knew and what he rapped about instead of being all over the place, which is another thing that puts me off of Biggie.
L was never going to get a chance to show his versatility on records as he didn't have the backing to have a crack at hitting the mainstream with club tracks and didn't seem particularly interested in doing so.
However, I don't think L was planning on dying so young so who can say what he'd have produced on later records.
If BIG had produced more records, who knows what direction he was headed, as I'd said before he was all over the place; club track, thug track, filler track, interlude, etc.
I agree that BIG had more charisma and presence, but that's part and parcel of being a gimmick. L was a straight up legitimate rapper who could hold down a great studio album as well as mix it up on the rap battle scene and the NY underground (so I guess there's some evidence of versatility) whereas BIG was more concerned with being a larger than life character who wanted to be both the worlds biggest pimp and worlds greatest rags to riches thug. I find it a little corny in all honesty.
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Do you think it's actually unfair to compare them in terms of production? I think that depends on exactly what we are comparing. Are we comparing the music produced by them? Are we comparing the skills of both rappers? If the latter, then doesn't an MCs ability to work in tandem with the beat come into play? With Biggie, when he'd tell a dark story, you'd fittingly get a haunting backing beat to supplement the story. With Big L, the beat and the rapper were a little bit more disconnected. As you said, that might put more focus on the rapper, but personally I really enjoy a rapper who create a cinematic vision with the combination of rap/beat.
The fact that L never showed versatility doesn't have anything to do with having a shot at the mainstream. He did punchline rap and that was that. Meth and Red were punchline rappers and they were very popular, but they also showed versatility in their albums. (check "Tical 2000" for Meth's apocalyptic vision and "Dare Iz A Darkside" for Red's example of what happens when a rapper becomes addicted to acid)
I don't think an "image" (in this case, Biggie being a thug) equals a gimmick. Sure it might give them a lyrical leaning, but that's not really a gimmick. I don't think charisma and mic presence comes with being a "gimmick". For example, check out Silkk the Shocker's stuff. He was very gimmicky with his totally-off beat nonchalant rapping but he didn't really have much personality or mic presence.
You also bring up that L was a "straight up legitimate rapper" but that brings up the question, what qualifies someone as that? Not having a mainstream appeal? Having limited subject matter? Mostly having qualities that appeal to underground hip-hop fans? (lyrical dexterity, internal rhyme schemes, alliteration, multisyllable rhymes, etc) What makes this song:
any less legitimate than this song?