Quote:
Originally Posted by elphenor
no but seriously how does one prove the "goodness" of something like Self-Rule without appealing to a higher morality
the average person in China is not necessarily more unhappy than someone in the US
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nobody said you could prove it
Utilitarian ethics can still be subjective. "Well being" and "suffering" can be subjective criteria.
You never answered my question. Why value democracy over tyranny or freedom over slavery? What is it specifically about these values that makes them self justified.
It seems like you're skipping back and forth from arguing that values are intrinsic to arguing that values are ultimately meaningless. You say democracy is self justified and then you say maybe people are happier in China. You haven't articulated what it is about democracy that makes you prefer it which is completely divorced from outcomes.