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Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA
The reason I feel the issue of women shaving their leg and underarm hair is an important gender issue, Tea, is that the pressure on women to remove much of their "unsightly" body hair is one of many sexist ways people treat women around the world, in which women are often judged and valued based more on appearance and sexuality rather than on their capabilities as human beings.
In this thread, girls/women have mentioned that they like BEING female, but they dislike the social issues they face. So, I feel it is important to challenge all the social issues that make being a woman difficult.
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I share your desire for men and women to have as much equal rights as possible, so people can just be comfortable with who they are instead of wishing they were something they are not. I think women have a lot of great things about them so it always saddens me that they still feel inferior because men have certain privilages.
However I don't believe we can be truly equal in
all ways, we have too many physical, even psychological distinctions. I'm rather traditional because I don't believe we should shun these all differences and we should take pride in them, women have things that set them apart from men but I think any heterosexual male will agree with me that that's a great thing and I'm sure heterosexual women feel the same way about men and the things that set them apart from women.
Heterosexuals are of course attracted to the opposite of what they are, we're not attracted to people who have too many of the same qualities as we do. Not just physically but personally as well, nobody wants to be stuck with a clone of themselves with only physical distinctions setting them apart.
In other words I'm a champion of diversity and a big reason I can be a harsh critic of certain kinds feminism is because I feel they shun the distinctions and privilages that come with being female instead of embracing them. My definition of feminism is wanting equal rights for men and women but at the same time embracing the fact that you ARE female and the fact that I AM male, and there's nothing wrong with either.
Instead of wanting to be a man or wanting to create a sexless society. Which is not only unrealistic and impossible, it's not something everybody wants either if you haven't figured that out.
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I feel that women and men should have equal rights, opportunities and treatment, which is the basis of feminism. It is simply unfair that men can have their body hair showing with no one chastising them, while women face ridicule for showing *their* hair.
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For the record, I think guys wearing shorts and sandals and showing their hairy legs/hooves is the ugliest thing in existence. Maybe most people wouldn't mock their appearance, but this assh*le surely will.
Also beards are acceptable somewhat but a lot of people still don't like them so if you have an especially long one that could still make getting a job difficult.
And of course a man can't hide his beard, a woman can hide her hairy legs, women wearing pants is perfectly acceptable. So if you want to not shave your legs but wear pants, NOBODY is denying you that choice. Yeah if you show your legs you will get mocked but if I started showing up to work in a dress I would get mocked too.
We all find certain things unattractive and unsightly, you do too I'm sure, that just isn't gonna change.
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Imagine that instead of women shaving we were talking about black people. If our culture told black people, "Sorry, your leg hair is ugly, so you should either wear trousers outside or shave your hair," while white people could go outside without any concern or feeling of self-consciousnes at all, would you be comforable with that? I doubt it.
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Sigh.
You know, I've told you a thousand times that I don't actually believe women HAVE to shave their legs right?
I just prefer that they do. I also prefer them not to be morbidly obese. You know thin women can wear bikinis and we think it's hot but when really fat women do it we think it's ugly. Why not make an issue out of that?
Aesthetics, look it up, everyone has an opinion about it.
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If it would bother you if BLACK people were told that their body hair is ugly and they should shave it off, cover themselves up, or suffer the consequences, why doesn't it bother you when people tell this to WOMEN?
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Aesthetics. Race roles are much more superficial than gender roles because gender roles sometimes (not always but sometimes) have a hint of scientific accuracy to them.
I've told you this before. Body hair is something we associate with masculinity but it's not for completely irrational reasons. It's a fact that men are naturally more hairy because of their testosterone levels, the hairier the man the higher it is. Women have less testosterone than men so they are less hairy, women that are unusually hairy have less estrogen in their stystem.
And yes, we associate testosterone with masculinity and estrogen with femininity but is it completely irrational to do this? No because it has an actual scientific basis.
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Just as the sexist view of women's body hair is unfair, it is also unfair that around the world women are often considered property, transferred to husbands, expected to bear many children and not receive a good education, forced to wear coverings over their hair or burkas, not allowed to drive cars, etc., while men face NONE of these socially-created problems. These issues, including body shaving, are all related because all involve women being treated as not deserving of the same social and legal rights as men.
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Now this is reaching a new level of absurdity. Having aesthetic preferences and standards and treating and selling women like cattle is
not the same f*cking thing. Yes we have aesthetic standards that only apply to women, we have aesthetic standards that only apply to men as well. This is common in the animal kingdom and it's not "unnatural" at all. We also have aesthetic standards that apply to both sexes, also not unnatural, just human nature.
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I recommend the short video "Shackled Women" to see examples of how the emphasis on women's beauty confines women's lives around the globe, since it's probably a topic in which you and I are both interested: Shackled Women
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Now just to be fair, somebody should make one about the men's fashion industry and how MEN are expected to look a certain way to please the opposite sex. If you don't think that BOTH sexes are expected to look certain ways to please the other sex then you are delusional.
Aesthetics is a major part of human sexuality. A utopian society where people don't judge by appearance at all may sound great to you and all that jazz but it's unrealistic to human biology.
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Women finally being able to wear pants without social derision *was* liberating...and it took several generations of strong women facing private and public ridicule to finally "earn" cultural acceptance of wearing manly pants. This step forward toward equality for women doesn't mean we should just accept one step back with regards to women's body image issues. There should never be any reason for women to be embarrassed by their own bodies, boo boo! Including their shaved heads! 
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Do you not read me ever? I DON'T think women should be denied the rights to show their hairy legs, I'm just defending people's rights to their asthetic preferences. Women have them too and don't tell me that men don't have to worry about living up to them.
My issue with you has always been the way you treat women who choose to shave their legs. And why is that so hard to grasp? I believe in equal rights, and part of that means accepting the decisions other people make as well as their opinions and that's the part you don't seem to understand.