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Old 08-15-2010, 09:25 PM   #101 (permalink)
SATCHMO
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inuzuka Skysword
There is a pretty big difference between the idea of trusting the aircraft and acknowledging the existence of a god. There is evidence pointing towards the idea that the aircraft is safe. There is no evidence of god.
The airplane analogy was not given for the purpose of showing that there is a god, but to demonstrate that humans engage in acts of faith on a fairly regular basis, whether or not we are consciously aware of it. There is a tendency to believe that faith is an act that is engaged in only when there is no empirical evidence to support what we believe. That is simply not true, which is why atheism requires every bit as much faith as theism does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inazuka Skysword
Why would religion make people happy? What does a religion have that understanding does not which enables one to be happier?
This presents a point of contention that I have with both sides of the theism issue, so in answering it I can only give you my own particular views, although I'm sure that they do represent the views of many others.

First, the term religion is a bit of a slippery one to work with. For one it represents a socio-political organization that is structured around a particular spiritual belief structure. There are people who have absolutely no affiliation with a particular religion and it's corresponding believe structure that receive a great deal of happiness through their own spiritual practices. Conversely, there are those that are actively involved in a particular religion that are miserable and simply use their religion for the actuation of their own misery. If being involved in a religion does not elevate one's consciousness then all one has done in becoming involved in one is joined a club, literally. Spirituality is, and religion should be, for the purpose of transcending the ego, and elevating one's level of consciousness.

There are many trappings that go along with our reliance on the ego, and while our ego does play a very important and practical part in navigating our reality, it is a very deceptive component of our psyche, as it forces us to be completely reliant on our sensory perceptions and the subjective way in which we analyze the respective data it provides us to formulate an assessment regarding the condition of our life, i.e. If something that we perceive as being "good" happens, we are happy. If something that we perceive as being "bad" happens, we are unhappy. Essentially we put ourselves in the situation where we are not just simply at the mercy of our external circumstances to dictate the quality of our life, we are at the mercy of our judgment regarding our perception of these circumstances to dictate the quality of our life.

Now what happens when we acknowledge the fact that these judgments that we make too many times a day to even mention, both consciously and unconsciously, are at best subjective, and at worst unreliable and even erroneous? I mean it is true, as much as you would like to be a proponent of the rational mind and its capacity for reasoning, the human mind's ability to comprehend the true nature of causality is extremely limited and the ego-driven mind is very much challenged to see anything circumstantial in anything but a non-linear way. What happens when we come to the understanding that the judgments that we make regarding the circumstances of our reality are anything but objective and rational, and have just as much impact on what we perceive as being our reality as the circumstances themselves? What happens when we rely instead on that which cannot be seen, but transcends the ego? The answer is that "happiness" becomes much less contingent upon, if not independent of, the external circumstances which we perceive as being reality, commensurately with the level at which our consciousness has been elevated through whatever spiritual practices we may happen to engage in, be they effective, or effectively practiced, at least.

If one chooses to "place their faith" in the minds ability to objectively apprehend and understand that which the senses provide it, over that which cannot be understood or apprehended through empirical means, then the purpose that human beings have for attempting to commune with the divine cannot be understood. In effect, the use of spiritual practice to transcend the trappings of the ego is the only way to bring about unconditional, true happiness, joy, which is not contingent upon external circumstances. And as anyone who has had an experience of this nature, be it momentary or long-term, it is well above and beyond any experience of happiness that can be provided through our own perception of what we would deem to be a positive circumstance.
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