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Key 05-31-2015 01:45 PM
I suppose I should put in a few points that I've had on my mind since everyone else seems to be doing so.

I said earlier in this thread that I really don't see any reason to change any rule enforcement that goes on at this site, and I stick by that. If this forum was as bad as some people think it is, they don't have to stick around like they do. Yes, there are rules that do get broken, and yeah, the mod team does send out warnings when that happens. 99% of the time, whatever or whoever was warned usually comes to a stop and the forum moves on from it. That's at least what i've seen in the past. The mods here aren't always cracking down on every single small broken rules here and there, because there really isn't any reason to. I would hate to see this forum become a place where every swear word or insult towards a member gets frowned upon / punished. Most of the time, when two or three members are insulting each other, it's either resolved between those members, or it's just a case of friendly teasing, which I myself am usually involved in. The fact that there are some people that think this forum needs to work on following rules, are some of the same people that tend to break those same rules. This forum is far more relaxed and fun to be at than most of the other forums on the internet right now. I do want to bring up the point as well that there's a reason people keep coming back to this site even when they feel they are fed up with it. It's the people, and the environment, and the fun of all of it. The harsh environment of this place at times is actually one of this sites best qualities, because it really allows you to see sides of people that you wouldn't normally see. If this place was more strict and "military school-ish" as some have said, we'd in return get a lot of members who have a shield up and would never truly show people who they really are or how they feel about certain things, because they'd feel they weren't allowed to. I think this whole thing about people needing to follow rules should really just be up to the individual people to realize that they need to mellow out in some cases, the mods shouldn't have anything to do with enforcing rules. And if people break rules, well...look at it this way: is it having a negative effect on the site or the people around here? If not, don't worry about it.

Trollheart 05-31-2015 01:45 PM
Yeah, I would definitely echo the lovely Roxy's sentiments. You guys do not get enough credit. It is a job that takes up a lot of your time and half of what you do we don't see, but if it wasn't done we'd be swamped in spam like my inbox. So while I very much respect Mojo and don't mod so I can't comment on the internal workings of the ModCave, I would say that each of you have your own approach to fixing problems here, they all work and I can't quite honestly think of one single mod here who I had a problem with. Even memberwise, it's a very very short list.

Oh, and bring back Right-Track! ;)

Seriously, Jansz, don't get disheartened. Your work and your tireless efforts to maintain some sort of order here without making it into a police state are definitely appreciated.

WWWP 05-31-2015 02:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1596383)
I'm curious how that would actually work though. It's easy to say "just infract everyone and problem solved", but on a practical level how would that be implemented? Modding is something people volunteer to do in their free time, not a full time job, so it's difficult make sure the entire site is patrolled thoroughly enough for the kind of consistent enforcement you're talking about. Also, a large chunk of the infracted will, of course, think that their posts weren't off-topic or needless so there will be the endless complaints and questioning that the mod team will have to contend with, and which more than likely will manifest itself as a whole lot of forum drama.
Yeah, you're right. I've never been a mod of anything with this scope, I really have no idea what the time commitment looks like, that's something I admittedly hadn't considered. The system I envisioned does look a bit too idealistic in retrospect, I really have no idea how it could be implemented.

Mojo 05-31-2015 02:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1596391)
Honestly, this just makes me feel like giving up. I'd comment on all the things I disagree with about this post but it hardly seems worth it.
Well I'm refraining from naming names, but when I was modding there were a handful of users that had all been here a long time, and the mod forum was awash with discussion about them. The majority were of the opinion they should have been banned already.

My point is it doesn't need to be a debate or a discussion.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo (Post 1596315)
Tore, Pedestrian, NSW and I all gave up our modship for at least some overlapping, similar reasons, and those reasons were all directly related to the way in which this site is modded.

Someone said earlier in this thread that there's no point trying to introduce something like what tore is suggesting because even if we do, mods are going to give certain members preferential treatment, when in fact that is what is happening already and it has always been the case.

I have no issue whatsoever with any of the mods here but I do think the site in general is modded like crap. Drama has come up time and time again in this thread and for good reason; drama has, at times, overtaken this site. This goes back years.

Drama has overtaken this site in many ways. We have allowed trolls to roam free for months, if not years, until finally deciding to pull the trigger. These trolls have proceeded to make this site a thoroughly annoying and unpleasant place to visit. We've also had members identified as trouble-makers to the point the site becomes divided in two and brimming with discussion around whether or not said member should still be here or should be banned. This kind of discussion, frankly, should rarely spill over onto the boards, because the rules should be tight and specific enough to avoid any kind of debate. They do however also need to be enforced.

I gave up my spot modding here because the drama didn't stop at the public boards but it spilled over into the mod forum also. While on the public boards we had trolls pissing people off, and cliques forming within, some calling for them to be banned, some jumping to their defence, and so on the mod forum we had a group of moderators also discussing and debating the same people and events. Should they be banned? Have they warranted a ban? Are people being too touchy? Can't they just block them? Should they need to block them? Will there be a backlash if we ban them? Is it worth a backlash? And so on and so forth. I'm sad to say that these discussions started to resemble too closely what could be perceived as a discussion around what the mods could maybe even do to have these troublesome members effectively hang themselves in a way in which nobody would be surprised to see them permanently banned.

I attempted to create a discussion within the mod forum around a system similar to what tore is proposing, where the rules are potentially updated and where the rules are most definitely better and more consistently enforced. Not to crack down harder on the users of the forum, not to start punishing people for minor offences, but to ensure everyone is being treated in the same way. Some trolls are clever and have much more time on their hands than you may think, in which to keep coming back to disrupt and ruffle feathers, and these are the ones that always created the most discussion because one minute you think they are breaking rules and intentionally pissing people off and the next you think they are just having a laugh and are actually here for genuine reasons. With a more consistent system in place these people would be banned much earlier on, the forums would be disrupted far less, this would be a much more enjoyable place to visit, and as long as everyone is very clear on what the rules are and how they are being enforced, there should be zero debate around the actions of the mods.

If you really feel you completely understand the rules here 100% and are without a doubt that they are being enforced correctly, then fair play to you. I'm not in a place to argue. But I would suggest that maybe you just don't see it.

Some members here will be banned for insulting someone or pissing off a mod, but take a member who has been here years and if they lose their head and commit the very same offence, they will get a tap on the wrists via a subtle PM and told to stop being such a dick. Then take into consideration that we have many different mods, all with their own favourites, all with their own users that they dont care for, all modding this place very differently, because that is the system we have in place. Yes we have rules, yes we have an infraction system, but we dont use them. We allow each person we entrust with modding this place to do it their own way and how they see fit, so is it really any surprise that every few weeks or months our boards are filled with drama about the latest poster here that is ruffling peoples feathers? It happens just as much in the mod forum too, believe me. It seems worthy of considering whether that is really still the best way to run this place.

Excellent response!

This has been the most honest and truthful post I have read in this entire thread.

It is sad that is will probably get overlooked.

Key 05-31-2015 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596449)

It is sad that is will probably get overlooked.
...but plenty of people responded to his post.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo (Post 1596437)
Well I'm refraining from naming names, but when I was modding there were a handful of users that had all been here a long time, and the mod forum was awash with discussion about them. The majority were of the opinion they should have been banned already.

My point is it doesn't need to be a debate or a discussion.
Pretty much

This is the Bottom line.


Just ENFORCE the rules.


There doesn't need to be a discussion. In addition there should be all new moderators besides maybe one or two people.

YorkeDaddy 05-31-2015 03:31 PM
This has been a fascinating, respectful discussion on all sides so bravo everyone, although as usual Soulflower antagonizes everyone on the other side so there's the exception.

I wouldn't be opposed to a trial run even though I personally still don't think a change needs to be made. I don't think a month is long enough to dramatically change the place but if we put it up to a vote I'd probably say give it a shot.

Janszoon 05-31-2015 04:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo (Post 1596437)
Well I'm refraining from naming names, but when I was modding there were a handful of users that had all been here a long time, and the mod forum was awash with discussion about them. The majority were of the opinion they should have been banned already.

My point is it doesn't need to be a debate or a discussion.
So basically we should be quicker to drop the banhammer on longstanding members? That doesn't seem like it would make the place a more pleasant environment.

Chula Vista 05-31-2015 04:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1596472)
So basically we should be quicker to drop the banhammer on longstanding members? That doesn't seem like it would make the place a more pleasant environment.
If a newbie screws up it's worse than if a long time member screws up in the same manner?

50 shades of grey indeed.

Key 05-31-2015 04:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1596472)
So basically we should be quicker to drop the banhammer on longstanding members? That doesn't seem like it would make the place a more pleasant environment.
I have to agree. If this were the way things would work around here, lots of the regulars here would be banned, and the community would just diminish. Stricter moderation is not always a good thing for a forum.

Machine 05-31-2015 04:20 PM
Well I ddint know this existed until just now and like Goofle I hate writing a lot to stuff like this so I'll make it short.

I personally see only harm in the proposal and it seems a lot of other memebers agree including the mods who've commented. I absolutely adore this site and would hate to see it change, I've made friends here that I wouldn't have made if it weren't for how this forum is set up. This site is like a family to me and I think a lot of people would agree and though I am a newer member of this family I'm extrmemly happy to be here and talk to these people the way I do. In fact I'd go as far to say if it were like any other forum I'd probably just leave.

Neapolitan 05-31-2015 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1596474)
If a newbie screws up it's worse than if a long time member screws up in the same manner?
Not that it is worse if a new member does it. There is less backlass if a new member (who exhibits obvious trollish behavior) gets banned than one who's been here a while forms friendship and has allegiances kinda like Survival Island.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chula Vista (Post 1596474)
50 shades of grey indeed.
New versus old members isn't the 50 shades of grey imo. It's what constitutes "trolling." It is such a catch-all for all kind of behavior, from deliberate starting fights with hot topic threads to replying only with *.gifs to making sarcastic, snarky, stupid, silly, sassy, saucy, smart-alecky or smarty-pants comments.

I can understand dealing with certain members who are really "trolling." I am not for people trolling forum members. But I wonder where the lines are going to be drawn, and who will be on the chopping block.

Since the site is seen too laxed, it can be that way for so long till like a pendulum it will swing the other way, the counter force pulling the pendulum the other way is by members who will ask for it to more heavily moderated, not just moderately moderated. What happens if the pendulum swings to far the other way?

Say a handful of serious members with no sense of humor wants to get rid of any member who has less of a serious side. They will belly ache to the mods until long standing members aren't serious all get the boot. It seems it will spill over from dealing with real trolls who really break the rules to members they don't like personally. That is why I'm not to crazy about Tore recommendation, and hope mods know who is who when it comes to trolling.

Goofle said in plug that 20% of the members should get infractions but don't... something like that. I wonder if that 20% isn't the few that make up 90% of the posts on the board and which 90% of that is non-music related. I hate to think any of those are members I like to plug with.

DwnWthVwls 05-31-2015 05:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ki (Post 1596476)
I have to agree. If this were the way things would work around here, lots of the regulars here would be banned, and the community would just diminish. Stricter moderation is not always a good thing for a forum.
I don't see a problem with that if it makes the forum a better place and attracts more activity. This seems to be the point everyone is latching onto because you're all "friends". Sansa is still around even though she doesn't post, there is always plug.

Trollheart 05-31-2015 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1596503)
It is such a catch-all for all kind of behavior, from deliberate starting fights with hot topic threads to replying only with *.gifs to making sarcastic, snarky, stupid, silly, sassy, saucy, smart-alecky or smarty-pants comments.

.
Jesus man! Half of that stuff is what you do a lot of (and so do I) and it's kind of the lifeblood of the community here. If we were all super-serious and afraid to say anything for fear of being banned or infracted, there'd be little enjoyment here. To return to my office analogy (though tore does not like it I think it's valid) it would be like those offices where you can't even smile at a member of the opposite sex or ask them how their weekend was without being pulled up by HR! Sod that. I would not want to be part of any environment that promoted, encouraged or fostered that kind of atmosphere.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 05:43 PM
Bring in new moderators--- check

Enforce the rules---- check

And that will break up the cliques, favoritism and the bully driven mentality of this board


I still would like to know why Sansa was banned because the reasons I have been given don't make any sense.

There are members who have said and done far worse but they are oddly still here.

The Batlord 05-31-2015 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trollheart (Post 1596523)
Jesus man! Half of that stuff is what you do a lot of (and so do I) and it's kind of the lifeblood of the community here. If we were all super-serious and afraid to say anything for fear of being banned or infracted, there'd be little enjoyment here. To return to my office analogy (though tore does not like it I think it's valid) it would be like those offices where you can't even smile at a member of the opposite sex or ask them how their weekend was without being pulled up by HR! Sod that. I would not want to be part of any environment that promoted, encouraged or fostered that kind of atmosphere.
http://www.troll.me/images/bert/tits-or-gtfo.jpg

Neapolitan 05-31-2015 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls (Post 1596506)
I don't see a problem with that if it makes the forum a better place and attracts more activity. This seems to be the point everyone is latching onto because you're all "friends". Sansa is still around even though she doesn't post, there is always plug.
She's banned from the site and I am seriously wondering if she should be a part if a plug room associated with MusicBanter. One night she put up a video of her sub or slave or whatever level he was in jumping naked on a bed, not once but twice. I honestly don't care who wants to defend that. I don't want to see that in plug. Whoever that guy is should have some self-respect. And if doesn't have it for himself then I don't think one should not show it to the world that he doesn't.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 06:00 PM
There have been other members that have posted non music in the plug such as movies, parts of video clips, etc.

So Sansa is not the ONLY one that does it. However, for the most part she plays music so I don't think this is even worth bringing up and if you are going to bring it up as an issue, then call out everybody not JUST her because there are other members that do the same thing.

And you have done some questionable things in the plug yourself...

Neapolitan 05-31-2015 06:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596543)
There have been other members that have posted non music in the plug such as movies, parts of video clips, etc.

So Sansa is not the ONLY one that does it. However, for the most part she plays music so I don't think this is even worth bringing up and if you are going to bring it up as an issue, then call out everybody not JUST her because there are other members that do the same thing.

And you have done some questionable things in the plug yourself...
Read what I said carefully... unless someone else posted their subs/slaves in plug, than so far she is the only one. Everything else you said is a red herring.

I think since that room is part of MusicBanter community then certain rules should carry over. And that includes:

Quote:
posting or linking to any disturbing, obscene, gory or pornographic material is strictly prohibited.
Please, read the Music Banter forum rules.

Freebase Dali 05-31-2015 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1596472)
So basically we should be quicker to drop the banhammer on longstanding members? That doesn't seem like it would make the place a more pleasant environment.
Not only this, but:

People may see it as a situation where we're banning noobs but not longstanders based on preferential treatment, but the reality of the matter is that noobs are easier to ban without affecting the overall community because they haven't invested anything into that community that would be missed.

Jans and all the other mods know EXACTLY how much we debated behind the scenes regarding Polama/Sansa/whatever because we knew the trouble she was causing but we also knew her value to many in the community. In the long run, we all decided that it was best for the community at large to make the decision we made after many slaps on the wrist. There were a lot of times before that point where a few mods advocated her removal far before it actually happened, but our approach was to give her a chance and finally do something when it became apparent that those chances were being taken for granted.

It's the same thing with any other longstander. Context has to be taken into account. Chances have to be given and the person has to fully show that they are unwilling to compromise before I, and dare I say much of the mod team, are willing to just cut them out. I think it's more wise to approach a longstanding contributor, in whatever way that is, differently than someone who just showed up on the doorstep a week ago. Not because it's preferential treatment, but because decisions you make regarding people that have formed relationships with many in a community is going to have a big enough effect for you to probably need to make sure you're doing what's best.

This isn't to say that the more friends you have here and the more you're around and creating content, the more immune to banning you are. CaptainCaveman, Sansa, and others proved that isn't the case at all. But I think a responsible moderator is not going to see longstanders and noobs as the same variables in the equation. It might be easier, but I don't think it takes into consideration what actually makes the site work.

Basically, try to help before trying to rid. Point systems in lieu of judgment puts the onus solely on the member, but point systems can't think. You could easily troll the hell out of this site just by waiting for your points to expire. What then... now we defer to moderator judgement? Why not let us judge in the first place?

fiddler 05-31-2015 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1596555)
Read what I said carefully... unless someone else posted their subs/slaves in plug, than so far she is the only one. Everything else you said is a red herring.

I think since that room is part of MusicBanter community then certain rules should carry over. And that includes:



Please, read the Music Banter forum rules.
I was under the impression that it did carry over because that was the chat, I could be mistaken, though.

As for the topic at hand, I honestly think the infraction system is a good idea, however, I would recommend the following:
  • Amending the current rules and allowing members to voice their opinions on the rules before they are finalized;
  • The vBullentin infraction system automatically sends the pm - all you as a mod have to do is give a reason for the infraction and send it off;
  • Moderators should apply the rules equally to all members, regardless of how long they have been on the forums (ex. if I tell TH to f*ck off and he tells me to f*ck off we should both receive the same infraction point);
  • It should also be noted that while the majority of us are adults, there are teens here and we should attempt to tone our language for their sake. However, there should also be an "adult-only" section where the language/content rules are slightly more relaxed;
  • Nobody is above the law, meaning that mods should receive the same punishment if they were to tell me to f*ck off as I would if I were to tell someone to f off;
  • Lastly there's nothing wrong with multiple warnings for the same offense. I would leave that up to the moderator in question, as long as they are consistent with it.

Just a few of my thoughts.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 06:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freebase Dali (Post 1596559)
Not only this, but:

People may see it as a situation where we're banning noobs but not longstanders based on preferential treatment, but the reality of the matter is that noobs are easier to ban without affecting the overall community because they haven't invested anything into that community that would be missed.

Jans and all the other mods know EXACTLY how much we debated behind the scenes regarding Polama/Sansa/whatever because we knew the trouble she was causing but we also knew her value to many in the community. In the long run, we all decided that it was best for the community at large to make the decision we made after many slaps on the wrist. There were a lot of times before that point where a few mods advocated her removal far before it actually happened, but our approach was to give her a chance and finally do something when it became apparent that those chances were being taken for granted.

It's the same thing with any other longstander. Context has to be taken into account. Chances have to be given and the person has to fully show that they are unwilling to compromise before I, and dare I say much of the mod team, are willing to just cut them out. I think it's more wise to approach a longstanding contributor, in whatever way that is, differently than someone who just showed up on the doorstep a week ago. Not because it's preferential treatment, but because decisions you make regarding people that have formed relationships with many in a community is going to have a big enough effect for you to probably need to make sure you're doing what's best.

This isn't to say that the more friends you have here and the more you're around and creating content, the more immune to banning you are. CaptainCaveman, Sansa, and others proved that isn't the case at all. But I think a responsible moderator is not going to see longstanders and noobs as the same variables in the equation. It might be easier, but I don't think it takes into consideration what actually makes the site work.

Basically, try to help before trying to rid. Point systems in lieu of judgment puts the onus solely on the member, but point systems can't think. You could easily troll the hell out of this site just by waiting for your points to expire. What then... now we defer to moderator judgement? Why not let us judge in the first place?

But the problem I have with some of the moderators is that there not fair. And a lot of times they give infractions to people that they don't like instead of objectively and maturely moderating the forums.

Also, I notice that there are moderators that are very disrespectful to members: call them out their name and are quite cruel here but they are oddly still moderators.

That's a problem.

I don't see how a member can be a moderator when they are disrespectful to other members themselves. Thats not a good role model for how a moderator should conduct themselves.

Soulflower 05-31-2015 07:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1596555)
Read what I said carefully... unless someone else posted their subs/slaves in plug, than so far she is the only one. Everything else you said is a red herring.

I think since that room is part of MusicBanter community then certain rules should carry over. And that includes:



Please, read the Music Banter forum rules.

I am telling you other members have posted sexual and porno like videos before. In addition, people post non music related videos in the plug ALL the time (which is not what the plug is for but members do, do it) so I think you should research more before you boldly claim another member is the ONLY one that does something. That was like the only one time she did that, that is not something she normally does and I can honestly say that because I have plugged with her numerous of times.

You have done some questionable things yourself in that plug for someone who is suppose to run it.


You skipped me multiple times one night in the plug. I was confused as to why you did that. I had said nothing and did nothing to you that night and you have also done it before.

I didn't say anything but just ignored it then.... but I found that to be beyond immature and a blatant abuse of authority.

RoxyRollah 05-31-2015 07:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596565)
But the problem I have with some of the moderators is that there not fair. And a lot of times they give infractions to people that they don't like instead of objectively and maturely moderating the forums.

Also, I notice that there are moderators that are very disrespectful to members: call them out their name and are quite cruel here but they are oddly still moderators.

That's a problem.

I don't see how a member can be a moderator when they are disrespectful to other members themselves. Thats not a good role model for how a moderator should conduct themselves.
Don't make me kill again.

RoxyRollah 05-31-2015 07:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596567)
I am telling you other members have posted sexual and porno like videos before. In addition, people post non music related videos in the plug ALL the time (which is not what the plug is for but members do, do it) so I think you should research more before you boldly claim another member is the ONLY one that does something. That was like the only one time she did that, that is not something she normally does and I can honestly say that because I have plugged with her numerous of times.

You have done some questionable things yourself in that plug for someone who is suppose to run it.


You skipped me multiple times one night in the plug. I was confused as to why you did that. I had said nothing and did nothing to you that night and you have also done it before.

I didn't say anything but just ignored it then.... but I found that to be beyond immature and a blatant abuse of authority.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596565)
But the problem I have with some of the moderators is that there not fair. And a lot of times they give infractions to people that they don't like instead of objectively and maturely moderating the forums.

Also, I notice that there are moderators that are very disrespectful to members: call them out their name and are quite cruel here but they are oddly still moderators.

That's a problem.

I don't see how a member can be a moderator when they are disrespectful to other members themselves. Thats not a good role model for how a moderator should conduct themselves.

Check your pms shortly.

Freebase Dali 05-31-2015 07:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596565)
But the problem I have with some of the moderators is that there not fair. And a lot of times they give infractions to people that they don't like instead of objectively and maturely moderating the forums.
I'm not quite sure how you're able to deduce the motivations for infractions given by moderators. Mostly because A) they're not public unless someone says they got an infraction and isn't lying, and B) you have no way of judging what went on behind the scenes with the mods regarding the incident.

I feel that maybe you are becoming disillusioned by your own assumptions here.

Quote:
Also, I notice that there are moderators that are very disrespectful to members: call them out their name and are quite cruel here but they are oddly still moderators.

That's a problem.

I don't see how a member can be a moderator when they are disrespectful to other members themselves. Thats not a good role model for how a moderator should conduct themselves.
I'd be interested to see some examples of this (not as a challenge) that are outside of the now-defunct "Spill Your Guts" thread.

Lisnaholic 05-31-2015 07:19 PM
Every contributing member here owes a big debt of gratitude to the mods because they are volunteering to make an effort for the sake of this community.

Even after reading this thread, I'm still ambivalent about the issue of being stricter about MB rules. Tore makes some very good points, but as Goofle says, what we have at present seems to work pretty well in general. If the mods felt that tore’s infraction system would help, I’d be fine with that too - or trying it for a month as VEGANGELICA suggests. Tweak a couple of the rules tore laid out, lose the "short post" one, and I don't think members would be living in the fear that Trollheart imagines.

However, no mod has shown enthusiasm for the proposal so far, and for me that's the clincher. Tore explained how his system might, at one level, help mods to do their (volunteer) jobs more efficiently, but the mods aren't convinced, and after all they'd be the ones implementing any new system. Whatever they decide is good enough for me.

DwnWthVwls 05-31-2015 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596567)
...
She's played her sub videos at least 4-5 times when I was in there. I don't mind, but it definitely wasn't a one time thing. Also, no one else has ever played anything that graphic. I'm actually surprised she played it with Nea in there it's usually only when she knows no one will be offended or care.

Freebase Dali 05-31-2015 07:25 PM
I'm willing to try anything that works. However, I need to be convinced that there's an actual problem I'm trying to fix. If the discussion is that there's an issue the mods need to be able to fix, I'm going to place more stock in the majority of the members of the community rather than an idea to fix what isn't broken.

Myself personally, I don't see any different problems here than I did in 2009 when I joined, and having been a mod for most of the time I've been here, I don't see us struggling behind the scenes apart from sometimes debating on what to do with a longstanding member. But it's less about systems in those cases and more about us doing our job and collectively deciding to do what's best for the community. This has not been a failure in my eyes.

If the community feels as though we're not addressing a problem, then I ask the community to tell us. But "community" is not one person. It's all of us.

DwnWthVwls 05-31-2015 07:28 PM
Like I said earlier before you joined the discussion. I think the mods could afford to be a little more proactive with removing posts that derail thread discussion on purpose, and arguments that result in aggresive/hurtful name calling with no actual point. Besides that I think you guys do a good job.

Neapolitan 05-31-2015 07:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596567)
I am telling you other members have posted sexual and porno like videos before. In addition, people post non music related videos in the plug ALL the time (which is not what the plug is for but members do, do it) so I think you should research more before you boldly claim another member is the ONLY one that does something. That was like the only one time she did that, that is not something she normally does and I can honestly say that because I have plugged with her numerous of times.
Stands to date she is the only one who played a video of her subs. I don't agree with that other video being played either. And anyone who plugs better understand that showing porn to minors is illegal. And in case you forget there are minors who belong to MusicBanter who plug.

She calls them "slaves" and/or "slaves" and you're cool with that? When she was here she would get her subs/slaves to follow her into MusicBanter or stalk her or whatever they were doing. And had one Scotty the Rebel harass us in plug.

You can't justify a wrong with the wrongs other people do. And I don't see defending her actions. Unless you're all cool with someone being treated like a slave or sub, for whatever reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596567)
You have done some questionable things yourself in that plug for someone who is suppose to run it.

You skipped me multiple times one night in the plug. I was confused as to why you did that. I had said nothing and did nothing to you that night and you have also done it before.

I didn't say anything but just ignored it then.... but I found that to be beyond immature and a blatant abuse of authority.
I don't remember skipping but I remember muting you, I said I did it by accident. I wanted to click @ but I clicked the wrong button. I remember apologizing about it. I thought we were cool with that. I apologize for any misunderstand about that happening.

Trollheart 05-31-2015 07:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596528)
Bring in new moderators--- check

Enforce the rules---- check

And that will break up the cliques, favoritism and the bully driven mentality of this board


I still would like to know why Sansa was banned because the reasons I have been given don't make any sense.

There are members who have said and done far worse but they are oddly still here.
You seem to be the only one here advocating new mods. I think the vast majority of us (ie everyone else) thinks they are all fine and nobody wants them to be replaced.

Also, you do love the term "bully" don't you? But you seem to be blissfully unaware that this is the exact behaviour you are carrying on here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulflower (Post 1596565)
But the problem I have with some of the moderators is that there not fair. And a lot of times they give infractions to people that they don't like instead of objectively and maturely moderating the forums.

Also, I notice that there are moderators that are very disrespectful to members: call them out their name and are quite cruel here but they are oddly still moderators.

That's a problem.

I don't see how a member can be a moderator when they are disrespectful to other members themselves. Thats not a good role model for how a moderator should conduct themselves.
Again, what does the bolded part mean? Anyone? "Call them out their name"???? I asked this before but you ignored me. If you're using it as supposed justification for something you should explain what you mean. Or am I just thick? Does everyone else know what she's talking about? And if so, can someone let me know because it makes no sense to me....?

Key 05-31-2015 07:40 PM
This is getting ridiculous. Is there a chance we can just stop talking about this and move on, and those still interesting can exchange ideas via PM? Sick of seeing this thread pop up constantly.

DwnWthVwls 05-31-2015 07:50 PM
I'm gonna bump it until it get locked just to annoy you. Welcome home :D

Neapolitan 05-31-2015 07:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ki (Post 1596589)
This is getting ridiculous. Is there a chance we can just stop talking about this and move on, and those still interesting can exchange ideas via PM? Sick of seeing this thread pop up constantly.
You don't have to hit New Posts every 15 seconds. If it's not your cup of tea just ignore it.

fiddler 05-31-2015 07:54 PM
It's a high dollar topic, and should be discuss openly without fear of prosecution for your thoughts, afterall, any changes to the way the forum is ran will effect all of us. Also, there's an option to mark all threads as "read".

Soulflower 05-31-2015 07:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1596586)
Stands to date she is the only one who played a video of her subs. I don't agree with that other video being played either. And anyone who plugs better understand that showing porn to minors is illegal. And in case you forget there are minors who belong to MusicBanter who plug.

She calls them "slaves" and/or "slaves" and you're cool with that? When she was here she would get her subs/slaves to follow her into MusicBanter or stalk her or whatever they were doing. And had one Scotty the Rebel harass us in plug.

You can't justify a wrong with the wrongs other people do. And I don't see defending her actions. Unless you're all cool with someone being treated like a slave or sub, for whatever reason.



I don't remember skipping but I remember muting you, I said I did it by accident. I wanted to click @ but I clicked the wrong button. I remember apologizing about it. I thought we were cool with that. I apologize for any misunderstand about that happening.

I am not insisting I am cool with anything.

I just think if you are going to shed light on an issue than don't just point out one member when there are other members who do similar things.


Also you did skip me back to back one night and I don't lie on anybody. I have said numerous positive things about you in the past and I was confused as to why you did it.


I've noticed there are others that have similar complaints about this site but don't say anything or have left. I think the reason why more members dont speak out is because they get bashed for it.

Key 05-31-2015 08:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls (Post 1596598)
I'm gonna bump it until it get locked just to annoy you. Welcome home :D
I hate you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neapolitan (Post 1596600)
You don't have to hit New Posts every 15 seconds. If it's not your cup of tea just ignore it.
Sorry, didn't realize my opinion on a thread didn't matter.

RoxyRollah 05-31-2015 08:03 PM
I just want to point out it's possible to accidentally mess up with the controls in plug.

I accidentally ignored fiddler for a good 20 minutes once and sent him an angry pm. All high and mighty like what you cant talk to me.... Don't I look silly now.

I also did something to Anticipation after our 8 hour session where he lost all his woots and had to make a new account. I am not sure how that one happened either.

Neo might not have noticed he did it.


And as far as the porn goes. If someone makes you uncomfortable, please say something to me and I will do what the situation calls for. Talking, warning, or 30 minute ban.

But as for a permaban from plug for Hermione I vote no. I am sorry but she was important to people here and I don't think ripping someone away from their people completely is fair in any way. I will not take part in crushing someone like that.

And everyone should be comfortable in plug. And if people aren't you guys need to speak up to someone with a stripe that can help you.


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