There is a difference between: Gnostic Atheists, Agnostic Atheists, Gnostic Theists, and Agnostic Theists..
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I wonder whether there are instances of internet debates about whether there is/isn't a god where in the end someone actually changed their opinion.
(Obviously I understand that such debates have a merit and can be fun without convincing anybody of anything.) |
Like I said, this is not something I would partake in outside of MB, but I know and respect everyone here and it is in fact fun for me to discuss. I'm okay with not changing Nea's mind, and yes it can be exhausting, but I enjoy critical thinking.. and tbh, I suck at putting my thoughts into words so it's good practice.
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How so? I'm not sure I follow. What is the scale?
Just for clarity, how I distinguish the 4 categories: -Gnostic Atheist - Rejects the theistic belief in god, claims there is no god (has burden of proof) -Agnostic Atheist - Rejects the theistic belief in god, does not make truth claims -Gnostic Theist - Believes in a theistic god, claims god exists (has burden of proof) -Agnostic Theist - Believes in a theistic god, does not make truth claims |
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Atheism/Theism addresses your position of belief Agnosticism/Gnosticism addresses the possibility of knowledge I agree agnostic atheist does seem a bit redundant, but it's necessary. You're okay with the other 3 categories? |
Why would it? Agnostic theists accept a claim as true, they are not making a claim of knowledge. Burden of proof only comes into play when you are making a truth claim. They are picking a side in the same way atheists are, but they are not claiming to know something.
To rephrase.. Agnostic Theists and Atheists: accept that they may be wrong and in light of evidence are willing to change their position Gnostic Theists and Atheists: make a claim about something they can not possibly know The only reason I believe gnostic atheists have any merit to even argue their position is because we have a ton of evidence for a naturalistic world and 0 evidence for a supernatural world, so it's not unreasonable to say based on what we know we can draw these logical conclusions. I consider myself an Agnostic Atheist, which is the default position and to me the most logical way to approach any situation where there is no evidence. |
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There were dozens of sections that I had to read a second time to fully absorb. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_Armstrong Simpy put, she puts belief, and non belief in the perfect context. I stopped being an atheist after reading this. Now I have no title. https://www.amazon.com/Case-God-Kare...aren+armstrong Quote:
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I'm an [insert a religion name here]
I'm an [insert a deprecated comment about any religion here] Me, personally? I'm nothing. Nothing at all. |
Thanks Chula, I'll check it out, but I don't read much nor do I have the time, so tbh I'll probably never actually read it.
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Edit: You should watch more AXP videos tbh. Matt Dillahunty is pretty great at logically attacking arguments, and does a way better job than I do at articulating the same points I'm trying to make. You probably won't agree with him on his beliefs that religion is evil or does harm, but you don't have to agree with someone on everything. I question some of the things he says as well. Also, he was a fundamentalist christian for 25 years and on his way to becoming a minister before he became atheist, so he knows a lot about the bible which is refreshing and maybe more palatable compared to science minded people like Dawkins. He does get pissy with callers, which might be off putting, but his points are almost always dead on. |
Read her book It WILL blow your mind. You'll be a different person at the other side of it.
Is God a thing or is God an idea? In the sane world God is Santa Claus. But if anyone decides that giving themselves to a "FAITH" helps them get through life, and deal with the BS life throws back at them then that's good to too. |
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