I think it's a parasite personally, so it should be up to the woman either way. It doesn't meet the qualifications of a living human.

We don't give something rights for being human (or at least it doesn't necessarily make sense to). We give something rights based on it's status as a person, which is distinct from being human. Some scientists, for instance, argue that dolphins and chimpanzees deserve to have at least some rights granted to a "person". Of course, defining what is or is not a person is difficult and sort of impossible to nail down perfectly. A zygote or an embryo or a sperm cell or an egg, clearly have no properties associated with personhood. They don't even have any sort of consciousness, for one.

Status? How so? If you're referring to third world countries or something, I think it would be much easier to keep this discussion focused on the United States, where the "human rights", like right to live, are pretty much universal regardless of status.

I don't understand your point. My point is that being human (i.e. having human DNA) doesn't necessarily make you a person, which is what determines what your rights are. Like others have said, someone who is alive and brain dead doesn't necessarily have the rights associated with personhood, even though they are certainly human. Same with a fetus (until a certain point) or a zygote.

And I agreed with that. I just didn't always make it a point to specify all the exemptions :wave:


Where exactly are we disagreeing here?

I thought that you were pro-life. If I'm wrong then what is your exact position?

Pro-choice, I just wanted to clear some things up with Tore. My position is it's not human yet, so it's not entitled to human rights like "right to live" (the ones that don't encapsulate brain dead folks, and others in similar situations)

Exactly. And I'm sick of men trying to make the decision for women.

Remind me never to knock Vanilla up. :shycouch: Joking.

What about women who try to make the decision for other women?

I agree with the Women doing what she wants with her body. I think the man should be involved to some degree considering he is part of the equation, what i mean by that is he should at least be notified of her decision and have the option of going with her if he so desires. Pretty catchy subject indeed.

I'm not exactly sure how your comment relates to my question here.

What exactly was your question? External pressure to make one choice over another? If so, I'm in agreement, though it's rare for a woman to be as invested in another woman's pregnancy as a man.

It doesn't i clicked the wrong post. My apologies.

Vanilla said that she's sick of men trying to make the decision for women. I asked if she's also sick of women trying to make the decision of other women.

I would think so, but Vanilla may be referring to men actively trying to pass legislation that gives men a voice in the matter. I don't think you have women legally trying to get a voice in the pregnancy simply because they're acquainted with the person in some way.

Not what I was talking about at all.

I guess the only way I would see there being any argument against it would be if it was a mother trying to convince her daughter otherwise.

Well you were addressing Vanilla were you not?

If she was referring to men trying to legally gain a say in the matter, and you were talking about just voicing their opinions, that's something completely different.

But I'll let her clarify herself.

Right, voicing an opinion. I understood Jansz just fine, he seems to have misunderstood my position.

I assume she was referring to male politicians trying to pass anti-abortion legislation and also males who support these politicians. I was simply asking if she took issue with women who support such legislation as well.

What makes you think that? I haven't even discussed your position with you. I just asked Vanilla a question and you started asking me to explain it.

I thought she was referring to men she knows on a personal level. Men like us in the topic who wanted to try and determine the legislation that goes into abortion.

By position I meant previous post.

Just to add to the confusion by throwing another option into the mix; perhaps she was referring to men who try to talk their partners in or out of getting abortions.

@Vanilla pls respond

This forum needs an alert and tag system

P. sure she's talking about politicians

Well first I like your avatar it is nostalgic

Secondly I am not a sympathetic person but to reach a point where I say "abortion is hilarious" you are either bored and not serious and just want to talk about something, or you might seriously have a social disorder
because taking lives is not hilarious by all means ._.

Who are you replying to? Quoting helps.

I think Moody is referring to Hermione.

Probably the OP. This started as a joke thread, didn't realize it until I bumped it.

ts.

Pro Life is Anti Woman..
 

..and other deconstructions of the argument. Behold

:laughing: I'm having the baby if you knock me up I'm bloody old enough to have a kid with
Being over partying every weekend.

Good point jans you are correct.

No I meant legislators who decide to make it legal. Also fundamentalist christians who are against it.

What I don't feel is right is families can decide for a daughter to have the baby but there are drug addicts who only care about the drug are having children which end up taken off them limiting that child's life if not trumatising them.

Ok, in that case I agree with Janszoon's original post.

agreed it goes around facebook to..
I think its the person's decision.
especially if its due to medical issues or they were raped.

F*ck this sh*thole country.

Simple solution, legislate it instead.

Did anyone even doubt this would happen? America is so close to being all but a theocracy at this point, they ought to just hoist the black flag and be done with it. Sale on burkas! Ninety percent off! Get them while they last! :rolleyes:

Nobody really respects the Supreme Court anymore. At least they didn't ban it altogether. It will still be legal in Maryland.

But it's just another thing that divides the country. We probably do need to break up.