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-   -   The Grumpy Old Man Thread (or, Why Today Sucks) (https://www.musicbanter.com/lounge/90564-grumpy-old-man-thread-why-today-sucks.html)

Trollheart 11-09-2017 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland (Post 1892401)
Your stance on a fictional film about a technologically advanced society with many scientific inaccuracies or impossibilities is based on logic derived from earth based technology and real-world expectations. That's retarded.

It's got nothing to do with any film. My point is that you can't hold a machine liable for mass murder. Batty maintains you can. I also don't give a ****, but his reading of it was so, to use your own word, retarded, that I thought I should explain it to him. I've given enough examples of why it's wrong, and am no longer interested in debating such a stupid thing anyway. If he wants to continue thinking as he does, fair play to him. I suppose I should never have kicked all this off by asking that question, but I was curious. That'll show me I guess.

Frownland 11-09-2017 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart (Post 1892410)
It's got nothing to do with any film.


A conversation about R2D2's free will is pretty clearly about Star Wars dude.

Quote:

My point is that you can't hold a machine liable for mass murder.
In the real world? Absolutely. In Star Wars? It's a fictional universe, anything is possible.

OccultHawk 11-09-2017 03:07 PM

Let’s hold a mock war crimes tribunal for R2.

Trollheart 11-09-2017 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland (Post 1892412)
A conversation about R2D2's free will is pretty clearly about Star Wars dude.

That bit yeah. My other points refer to the basic nature of robots.
Quote:


In the real world? Absolutely. In Star Wars? It's a fictional universe, anything is possible.
There's got to be some sort of adherence to logic. In Star Trek, Kirk can't just fly because he wants to. In Alien, Ripley can't click her heels together to get away from the monster. And R2D2 is a non-sentient robot, who therefore can't be held responsible for any killing he may end up being involved in. Fantasy films can change the rules, even write their own. Science-fiction, even soft sci-fi such as Star Wars, can't. Science is in the description.

Frownland 11-09-2017 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart (Post 1892415)
There's got to be some sort of adherence to logic.

Nope. It is a fictional work, so there are absolutely zero requirements for logic.

Trollheart 11-09-2017 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk (Post 1892414)
Let’s hold a mock war crimes tribunal for R2.

I'm down for this. Who'd be on the jury?

Trollheart 11-09-2017 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland (Post 1892416)
Nope. It is a fictional work, so there are absolutely zero requirements for logic.

Don't be silly. Even in fiction you have to stick to certain points of logic. Except, as I mentioned already, in Fantasy/High Fantasy/Comic Fantasy.

Frownland 11-09-2017 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart (Post 1892418)
Don't be silly. Even in fiction you have to stick to certain points of logic.

Says who? What happens when you deviate from logic in a work of fiction?

The Batlord 11-09-2017 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart (Post 1892410)
It's got nothing to do with any film. My point is that you can't hold a machine liable for mass murder. Batty maintains you can. I also don't give a ****, but his reading of it was so, to use your own word, retarded, that I thought I should explain it to him. I've given enough examples of why it's wrong, and am no longer interested in debating such a stupid thing anyway. If he wants to continue thinking as he does, fair play to him. I suppose I should never have kicked all this off by asking that question, but I was curious. That'll show me I guess.

I maintain that George Lucas wrote R2D2 as a character and not a mindless automaton. Your overthinking of the matter is illogical, not logical, because we're talking about George goddamn Lucas, who pays as much attention to science as he feels like whenever the hell he feels like. There's even an in universe explanation, even though it's from the EU and therefore not canon, but that is clearly in-line with the implications made in the movies: that droids are legally required to have their memories wiped periodically or else they can eventually obtain sentience, and R2 and 3PO have gone decades without memories wipes.

Trollheart 11-09-2017 04:36 PM



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