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ThePhanastasio 09-09-2011 08:44 PM
Twin Peaks
 
http://www.popentertainment.com/twinpeaks.jpg
"She's dead - wrapped in plastic."

Not too long ago, I got on a huge Ray Wise kick. It seemed ridiculous to me that a man so full of talent should be so widely unknown. As such, I went mad watching nearly everything the man has done, so that I could better justify to myself just how exemplary a performer he was and is, and how tragic it is that he's not got a single award under his belt.

My viewing led me to Twin Peaks, a television series for which I'd heard very mixed reviews, but that was directed by David Lynch - an attribute I found beyond positive.

It soon became apparent that Ray Wise, although playing Leland Palmer, father to Laura Palmer whose death the show was set up to be based around, was not going to be one of the main characters - or at least not really. But I watched the show in its entirety anyway...

I guess what I'm really saying is that I came for Ray Wise, but I stayed for Kyle MacLachlan, the brilliant actor who, in this program, portrayed Special Agent Dale Cooper.

I'd seen Blue Velvet some years back and really loved it, but never bothered to really pay attention to the actors in the film; it was more the piece that I was interested in, and not the various cogs that made it work. As such, it was during my marathon watching of Twin Peaks that I became aware that our lab, Orson, is actually named for Kyle MacLachlan - apparently he was a major character on Desperate Housewives, named Orson Hodge - and my dog's "middle name" is Kyle, for the actor who portrayed said character. Needless to say, I felt a little ridiculous for not having acknowledged this man's brilliance previously.

I also found myself oddly drawn to the town and the characters who resided within it; granted, the population of Twin Peaks is shown in the title sequence to have in excess of 50k people, and my town has less than half that, but it really felt like home almost. Even if it's set clear on the other side of the country.

Yesterday, I went to hang out with my friends, and we were talking about Twin Peaks - I'd watched every episode, sans finale, and recall saying, "I know that one of two things is going to happen when I watch the finale; I'm either going to cry like a bitch, or I'm going to completely die inside and feel completely numb."

Strangely enough, both things happened.

I'm not going to offer any spoilers, for those who've not yet watched the show, but I am going to ask that if anyone else is a fan of the show, they contribute their takes on it here - using spoiler tags appropriately, of course.

Janszoon 09-09-2011 08:49 PM
Great show! I didn't like it all that much when it was originally on TV but a couple years ago I went back and watched the whole series, and really enjoyed it.

Farfisa 09-10-2011 07:32 AM
I went on a Twin Peaks kick a few months ago. It was all I talked about, but I had to take a break from it (only a few episodes and the movie to go). I love lynch, his bizarreness and his ability to throw that stuff on a major network. It makes me wonder how some women can just totally fall head over heels for James and his inability to resist their advances which in turn causes stupid problems with Donna. Agent Cooper is a kind goofball with an unwavering dedication to his work, which makes makes him one of my favorite characters. Audrey Horne, Audrey Horne, what a doll, I would totally sweep her off her feet and we'd travel the world together *sigh*, but I have a feeling she'd leave me for another dude.

Also, creamed corn


Howard the Duck 09-10-2011 09:18 AM
i was a huge fan and i got the entire thing on DVD, plus deleted scenes (which are on Super 8 cos they apparently wiped off the original print)

i am of the view it was kinda meandering and aimless after Laura's killer was revealed, but only showed some strength in the final few episodes

perhaps in Season 3 (which never happened cos it was cancelled), it would get better again

Janszoon 09-10-2011 10:03 AM
Over 20 years later and it still amazes me that a show like that was ever on network TV, especially during that era.

duga 09-10-2011 10:38 AM
I recently watched Twin Peaks as well. I've been a David Lynch fan for a while now and kept hearing good things about the show. I ran across it on Netflix and for a while it was pretty much all I was watching.

My girlfriend and I have constant debates now on what the show means. While the ending was so ambiguous and so many questions were left unanswered, I think it totally fits the David Lynch aesthetic. Because it was such an intense cliffhanger, it kept me thinking about it for a while after I was done with it. David Lynch's best work always stays with me and Twin Peaks was no different. I actually feel like going back through the series to see if I can pick up anything new.

If you really enjoyed the show, definitely watch Fire Walk With Me. It's a prequel movie that takes place a week before Laura's murder. The humor of the show isn't there and it is a pretty dark movie, but it's still worth checking out. Although by the end you kind of can't wait for Laura to get killed...she's really damn annoying.

Now...if anyone wants to discuss wtf this show means...let's do it. This is one of the craziest shows I've ever seen.

LoathsomePete 09-10-2011 03:51 PM
I seem to recall Lynch said that the cliffhanger wasn't meant to be the end of the series, that more movies were to follow after Fire Walk With Me, but after its disastrous reception at Cannes and Sundance, he abandoned the idea.

Janszoon 09-10-2011 06:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoathsomePete (Post 1102601)
I seem to recall Lynch said that the cliffhanger wasn't meant to be the end of the series, that more movies were to follow after Fire Walk With Me, but after its disastrous reception at Cannes and Sundance, he abandoned the idea.
I've heard that they were expecting to at least do another season of the show but it was cancelled abruptly by the network.

ThePhanastasio 09-10-2011 06:58 PM
I'm not sure if anyone here's really heard of this, but the character Dale Cooper was (strangely) an allusion to a real person:

D.B. Cooper, Wiki

Also, I've never heard of the actual inspiration for the premise, but a rather serendipitous thing occurred today - and I think that maybe, just maybe, I've stumbled across the real life inspiration. In my local newspaper. While watching Twin Peaks with my mother. We're both concerned at how weirdly coincidental my opening the newspaper and the opening credits of Twin Peaks beginning to play worked out.

Janszoon 09-10-2011 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePhanastasio (Post 1102628)
I'm not sure if anyone here's really heard of this, but the character Dale Cooper was (strangely) an allusion to a real person:

D.B. Cooper, Wiki

Also, I've never heard of the actual inspiration for the premise, but a rather serendipitous thing occurred today - and I think that maybe, just maybe, I've stumbled across the real life inspiration. In my local newspaper. While watching Twin Peaks with my mother. We're both concerned at how weirdly coincidental my opening the newspaper and the opening credits of Twin Peaks beginning to play worked out.
I'm familiar with the D.B. Cooper story but I wasn't aware there was any Twin Peaks connection.

ThePhanastasio 09-10-2011 11:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duga (Post 1102546)
I recently watched Twin Peaks as well. I've been a David Lynch fan for a while now and kept hearing good things about the show. I ran across it on Netflix and for a while it was pretty much all I was watching.

My girlfriend and I have constant debates now on what the show means. While the ending was so ambiguous and so many questions were left unanswered, I think it totally fits the David Lynch aesthetic. Because it was such an intense cliffhanger, it kept me thinking about it for a while after I was done with it. David Lynch's best work always stays with me and Twin Peaks was no different. I actually feel like going back through the series to see if I can pick up anything new.

If you really enjoyed the show, definitely watch Fire Walk With Me. It's a prequel movie that takes place a week before Laura's murder. The humor of the show isn't there and it is a pretty dark movie, but it's still worth checking out. Although by the end you kind of can't wait for Laura to get killed...she's really damn annoying.

Now...if anyone wants to discuss wtf this show means...let's do it. This is one of the craziest shows I've ever seen.
Out of classiness, I'm going to hide most of my response in spoiler tags. Just to be on the safe side. If someone reads it, they'll still probably not make sense of it, but I'm going to try to be nice about it. :)

Spoiler for TWIN PEAKS SPOILERS - DO NOT READ IF YOU'VE NOT SEEN THE SERIES.:

Basically, the most important thing to keep in mind, I think, if you want to know what Lynch's intended version of the ending is, is who died in the finale.

You could easily see that Dale's doppleganger made it out of the lodge, not Dale himself. There was also the matter of Ben Horne's head being cracked against the fireplace by Dr. Hayward - he lived, according to Lynch. Audrey, however, who was chained to the door of the bank vault when the explosion occurred, died.

So this leaves Dale trapped in the black lodge, Annie safe and away from Dale, Ben alive, and Audrey dead.

It's common knowledge that Lynch intended for Agent Cooper to have pursued something with Audrey - it seems somewhat logical then that Audrey could possibly find herself in the Black Lodge with the real Dale, and try to help him get out, were there a third season or movies following Fire Walk With Me.

I'm going to say that Annie - and Billy Zane's character whose names escapes me - were the characters who most pissed me off in the series. The Dale / Audrey thing had been hyped up, and then Dale was all, "Oh, I can't Audrey; one, you're too young. Two, last time I got involved with someone involved with a case, they got killed and I got my heart shattered. Oh, and not too long afterwards, when I know the dude who killed the love of my life is in town, I'm going to decide that's the perfect time to pursue an open and public relationship with another woman, who I'm irrationally drawn to in spite of the fact that she's completely bland."

And Audrey was all, "Well, I'm going to get older, and I'll be here - but you know what, Billy Zane is going to be devilishly handsome, and I'm going to fall irrationally in love with him after a brief period of time, and bang him on an airplane shortly before my demise."

And they were both all, "Oh, well, naturally. That makes perfect sense."

But, back to the weird parts that don't necessarily piss me off as much as the Audrey/Dale angle:

Hawk told Dale that if he went into the Black Lodge with imperfect courage, his soul would be damaged - which is what I'm pretty certain led to doppleganger-Bob-Dale coming out of the Lodge.

The Jupiter/Saturn alignment happens approximately once every 20 years, so it would be actually right around now (or a few years ago, really) that the whole ordeal would result in the lodge being "open" again.

The Black and White lodges, I believe, are just a sort of symbolic "Good vs. Evil" thing. But, in TP canon, they're real and tangible, of course.

There's a bit more that I could say, but I'm kind of drunk, and don't really want to type anymore.

Scissorman 09-11-2011 04:40 AM
I was obsessed with Twin Peaks, but the movie was HORRIBLE. It was completely pointless and the fact that Lara Flynn Boyle was replaced made me like it even less.

Howard the Duck 09-11-2011 05:08 AM
the movie was alright to me, but it didn't capture the "feel" of the series (none of its humour was reproduced) and it felt more like a generic Lynch vehicle

duga 09-12-2011 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoathsomePete (Post 1102601)
I seem to recall Lynch said that the cliffhanger wasn't meant to be the end of the series, that more movies were to follow after Fire Walk With Me, but after its disastrous reception at Cannes and Sundance, he abandoned the idea.
Yeah, the next season was going to focus on rescuing Dale from the Black Lodge. Even though it wasn't intentional, I still think the cliffhanger ending made the series much more intriguing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePhanastasio (Post 1102672)
Out of classiness, I'm going to hide most of my response in spoiler tags. Just to be on the safe side. If someone reads it, they'll still probably not make sense of it, but I'm going to try to be nice about it. :)

Spoiler for TWIN PEAKS SPOILERS - DO NOT READ IF YOU'VE NOT SEEN THE SERIES.:

Basically, the most important thing to keep in mind, I think, if you want to know what Lynch's intended version of the ending is, is who died in the finale.

You could easily see that Dale's doppleganger made it out of the lodge, not Dale himself. There was also the matter of Ben Horne's head being cracked against the fireplace by Dr. Hayward - he lived, according to Lynch. Audrey, however, who was chained to the door of the bank vault when the explosion occurred, died.

So this leaves Dale trapped in the black lodge, Annie safe and away from Dale, Ben alive, and Audrey dead.

It's common knowledge that Lynch intended for Agent Cooper to have pursued something with Audrey - it seems somewhat logical then that Audrey could possibly find herself in the Black Lodge with the real Dale, and try to help him get out, were there a third season or movies following Fire Walk With Me.

I'm going to say that Annie - and Billy Zane's character whose names escapes me - were the characters who most pissed me off in the series. The Dale / Audrey thing had been hyped up, and then Dale was all, "Oh, I can't Audrey; one, you're too young. Two, last time I got involved with someone involved with a case, they got killed and I got my heart shattered. Oh, and not too long afterwards, when I know the dude who killed the love of my life is in town, I'm going to decide that's the perfect time to pursue an open and public relationship with another woman, who I'm irrationally drawn to in spite of the fact that she's completely bland."

And Audrey was all, "Well, I'm going to get older, and I'll be here - but you know what, Billy Zane is going to be devilishly handsome, and I'm going to fall irrationally in love with him after a brief period of time, and bang him on an airplane shortly before my demise."

And they were both all, "Oh, well, naturally. That makes perfect sense."

But, back to the weird parts that don't necessarily piss me off as much as the Audrey/Dale angle:

Hawk told Dale that if he went into the Black Lodge with imperfect courage, his soul would be damaged - which is what I'm pretty certain led to doppleganger-Bob-Dale coming out of the Lodge.

The Jupiter/Saturn alignment happens approximately once every 20 years, so it would be actually right around now (or a few years ago, really) that the whole ordeal would result in the lodge being "open" again.

The Black and White lodges, I believe, are just a sort of symbolic "Good vs. Evil" thing. But, in TP canon, they're real and tangible, of course.

There's a bit more that I could say, but I'm kind of drunk, and don't really want to type anymore.
I completely agree that the Annie/Billy Zane thing was annoying. I feel like it was a band-aid for when they decided to not go with a Dale/Audrey romance. I get the feeling it was supposed to be Audrey who won the Twin Peaks beauty pageant and then Dale had to go trek into the Black Lodge to rescue her, but since they decided it would be weird (and Kyle MacLachlan always hated the idea of an adult FBI agent hooking up with a high schooler), they had to throw in a new and completely random storyline.

To me, though, the focus of the show was only originally about Laura's murder. After a while, it become strictly about the meaning and existence of the Black and White lodges. Laura's murder just catalyzed everything that happened. That's why even though not much was answered in Fire Walk With Me, it did give us some insight. First, that time most definitely does not exist in the lodges (Annie reveals herself to Laura and mentions how Dale is trapped in the Black Lodge despite this being a few days before her death). Second, that the denizens of the lodge are not necessarily good and evil...they sort of keep a balance. Bob is one extreme of evil and the giant is an extreme of good. The Man From Another Place is kind of inbetween, but at one time had been totally evil, throwing the balance out of whack. We find out that he was originally Mike's arm, and it was lobbed off when he got too powerful. They also collect human emotion in the form of creamed corn (which they call garmonbozia). Not really sure what's up with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scissorman (Post 1102698)
I was obsessed with Twin Peaks, but the movie was HORRIBLE. It was completely pointless and the fact that Lara Flynn Boyle was replaced made me like it even less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Il Duce (Post 1102705)
the movie was alright to me, but it didn't capture the "feel" of the series (none of its humour was reproduced) and it felt more like a generic Lynch vehicle
Yeah, Laura Flynn Boyle not being in it did bother me, too. I thought the movie actually served its purpose well, though. Twin Peaks was dark when it needed to be dark and humorous when it needed to be humorous. The week before Laura's death was obviously very dark, so it was going to be a dark movie. Despite Laura being annoying as hell, I'm glad they showed what they did. Especially the strained relationship between Laura and her parents.

bob. 09-12-2011 04:25 PM
i like the way you put that Duga...."Laura's murder just catalyzed everything that happened.".....i do my best when viewing anything with David Lynch's name on it....to not dig deep into it.....as i feel all the answers are there...just they are in metaphor.....i kind of feel this was the goal from the beginning....but neither he nor Frost expected this to become such a pop culture phenomenon

and from what i've read there was quite a bit of pressure from the studio to release who killed Laura.....but in fact the show is really more a concentration on Agent Cooper and the lodge's

i don't know its really been about 10 years since i've ever re-watched any of these and i just started today....so i'll be back soon :)

tattoo win (spoiler)

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra 09-16-2011 05:24 PM
I'm curious... is your name a reference to Twin Peaks, bob?

Also, on a strange note, albeit he looks nothing like him, Mitt Romney reminds me worlds of Leeland Palmer, and I'm not sure why.

bob. 09-18-2011 09:11 AM
yes and no.....my birth name is Robert and for some reason it is acceptable to go by "bob" when your name is robert....when i turned 30 i decided to do this.....and i cannot lie Twin Peaks and Crispin Glover's concept of "Bob" were an influence

starting season two today :).....

Howard the Duck 09-18-2011 09:12 AM
^^'ave fun

ThePhanastasio 07-19-2013 01:18 AM
I still cannot feasibly get behind a world where Dale Cooper and Audrey Horne were not meant for each other. ****ing Kyle MacLachlan. And Lara Flynn Boyle, who he was dating at the time. Those two, Audrey and Dale, had such chemistry that it would have made the whole series stick together, even after Laura's murder was solved. The fact that Audrey and Coop had already been dropped and Windom Earle was forced to the forefront was damaging.

That they forced both Dale and Audrey into impromptu and puzzling relationships helped nothing. It could have gotten a third season if there had been any romantic intrigue. Then they ****ing killed Audrey, and I think Dale'd have gone into the Black Lodge and been destroyed regardless, but, goddammit, if it'd have been for Audrey, it'd have meant something more.

I detested Annie and Billy Zane.

The Annie character had approximately half the charisma of Kristen Stewart's Bella, and was so contrived that I could never take her seriously.

Yac 07-19-2013 06:56 AM
Jesus, Twin Peaks. There is just something about Bob that after all these years, I still feel fear deep down in my gut. In fact while I watched the series again a couple of years ago, (and laughed and trembled in fear) I still haven't seen Fire Walk With Me. Because of Bob. God damn :D Can I consider myself a victim of David Lynch ? The only movie that left me with such a traumatic experience was the Japanese Ring, when I saw it completely unprepared.

Goofle 10-17-2014 05:01 AM
Who would you cast in a re-boot assuming that's the direction they take?

I think Alanna Masterson (off The Walking Dead) would make for a good Audrey, or even Donna.

Oriphiel 02-12-2017 10:08 AM
Figured I should bump this since the new season is coming in a few months. Anyone else excited?

Frownland 02-12-2017 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzy Creamcheese (Post 1804715)
Figured I should bump this since the new season is coming in a few months. Anyone else excited?
I chopped off one of my testicles and mailed it to David Lynch with a letter telling him that he'll get the other one if the season is good.

Oriphiel 02-12-2017 10:58 AM
:laughing:

Key 02-12-2017 11:11 AM
I have to thank Frownland for pushing me to watch this when I said I was gonna watch it. I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Chiomara 02-12-2017 12:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzy Creamcheese (Post 1804715)
Figured I should bump this since the new season is coming in a few months. Anyone else excited?
YES

The scenes with Gordon and Shelley in the diner are probably among my absolute favorites of the series; it's so sweet. "I FEEL AS THOUGH MY STOMACH IS FILLED WITH A TEAM OF BUMBLEBEES!"


I don't know how I've survived this long, honestly. I've been obsessed ever since I saw it on Netflix years ago. Garland Briggs was my favorite character. I believe the actress that played the log lady died in recent years, though. :c

Has anyone speculated at all as to what the plot may be?

Though it seems to be reviled by many, I love Fire Walk With Me-- I find it so hypnotic--and listen to the soundtrack almost daily.

Oriphiel 02-13-2017 05:27 AM
I haven't read much about the new season, since I don't want to spoil anything for myself, so I'm not sure what's in store plotwise. My guess is that it'll have something to do with what happened to Cooper at the end of season 2, though.

By the way, I also liked Fire Walk With Me. But I can definitely see why other people hated it.

Exo 02-13-2017 11:47 AM
See avatar for proper gauge of my excitement.

Frownland 02-13-2017 12:20 PM
It kinda looks like you don't give a **** about anything.

Exo 02-13-2017 12:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frownland (Post 1805223)
It kinda looks like you don't give a **** about anything.
Exactly.

Oriphiel 02-24-2018 03:26 AM
Finally got the chance to start watching the new season, and just finished part one of the first episode

I have two things to say about it

1. Lol, wtf?

2. Want more

Oriphiel 03-03-2018 12:47 PM
Omg, Coop/Dougie just chopped a midget in the throat

I love this show

Oriphiel 03-25-2018 01:10 PM
Okay, so I got to the end, and now I've gotta ask...


What the actual fuck did I just watch? Can anyone explain it to me?


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