Nah it wasn't a cheap shot I was just right.

In my opinion musically punk can be characterized by shorter song length, yelled vocals, and a fast tempo with lyrics that are pretty frank, we all know that much.

The punk subculture associated with punk rock is aesthetically defined with tattered jeans and clothes that aren't really socially accepted. Some punks will just go out in plain t shirts and jeans though.

I'm not going to get into punk ideologies since they differ so much from band to band.

When it comes down to it, you can play punk music and not be a stereotypical punk. You are relying to much on upholding the punk stereotype.

And Leftover Crack and Choking Victim esque bands are in no way an ultra minority nowadays.

wow that was a self gratifying post. i know what punk is, and what stereotype am i trying to keep up? the one where i said that andrew jackson jihad is punk? the one where i said that patti smith is punk?

as i said before, indie is more punk than punk is these days (although that is changing with bull**** indie artists like MGMT) there is no stereotype except for maybe having a ****ing spine and not buying into the awful commercialism that music today is so entrenched in. and i know, much has always been commercialistic, but that is why punk came about. punk was founded on an ideal therefore it has to be idealistic and have convictions to be punk. if it is not, if it is just three chord bull for the sake of three chord bull and that is pop ( and don't even get me started on pop punk, popular punk is such a ****ing hypocrisy).

i just want the music to be real. the artists that i originally was arguing against have not made real music, maybe they started out with a few decent cds but then they became whores, and that means that is all they were in the first place.

I guess we disagree on some levels.

yeah i'd say so, you have a valid point or two though

I was cruising through here in hopes that some where Bikini Kill would be mentioned, and you have won the key to my heart. I have not been expossed to much punk, the occasional Misfit song has been played for me, I have some Rancid and The Ramones on my I-pod but have not given them a good chance. I am how ever in love Bikini Kill. I gave them a chance, fell in love, and now I want to have thier crazy feminist babies. I do find this thread rather instersting though and will come back tommarrow to give it a good read.

Well, if you like boundary pushing you could always give The New York Dolls a spin, which is also on the above list you'll see. ;) Siouxie and the Banshees, and The Stooges are few more decent bands on that list I'd recommend, but not for any other reason but to try them. The rest of that stuff I could take it or leave it. Hope you have fun giving the thread a good read and welcome to the boards. =) PM if you need an up for Siouxie and the Banshees btw.

^i completely agree, the New York Dolls are amazing, so are the stooges. and they were so instrumental in the creation of punk

No order
Rise Against
A Global Threat
Sex Pistols
Misfits
Minor Threat
Anti-Flag
Green Day(Dookie)
NoFX
Negative FX
Black Flag

My age is 16 and location is Arizona.

Bikini Kill sucks

here let me fix that for you