there should be an option for that Heaven & Hell album

current fave at the mo', cos it sounds so.... "Malay"

I just can't comprehend how my two favourite Ozzy-era Sabbath album's, Vol 4 and Sabotage, have a combined total of three votes while my two least favourites (bar maybe Technical Ecstasy and Never Say Die, which I hardly ever listen to), Paranoid and Black Sabbath, are winning this poll by a huge margin.

Sabotage I never thought was a great album anyway despite it having some killer tracks, but I`ll agree with Vol 4 its one of the Sabbath classics and far better than the debut which seems to have pinched most of its votes.

I`d rate the Ozzy albums like so:

Master of Reality> Paranoid> Sabbath Bloody Sabbath> Vol.4 (These are the four masterpieces) followed by Black Sabbath> Sabotage> and both Technical Ecstasy and Never Say Die as far as I`m concerned are, nowhere near as bad as they are made out to be and have some good material on them.

For me it goes like this: Vol 4 > Sabotage > Master of Reality > Sabbath Bloody Sabbath > Black Sabbath > Paranoid (although the last two are interchangeable) > Technical Ecstasy > Never Say Die.

However I also agree that Technical Ecstasy and Never Say Die are in no way bad albums, they are just the weakest two. The fact they were the final two with Ozzy as well means they get a heavier criticism. Had they been the bands first two albums, they would be treated with a little more leniency.

I think if they were the bands first 2, we would not be discussing them today.

Well, Paranoid and Sabotage. Megalomania is one of my favorite songs of all time.

Why not? If they had been the bands first two then they would either be forgotten about (which may be what you mean) or they would be seen in a much more generous light as stepping stones to greatness, rather than the albums that dragged Sabbaths stock down a little before Ozzy left.

I guess in short what I am saying is if they started out on a low point like those 2 albums rather than a high note like their first, would they have the influence they do today?

Say they came out with something like those albums, sure it could be a stepping stone to much greater things, but in the time it took them to get to those greater things, another band would have probably released something off the bat that was great and gotten the credit that Sabbath has today. I think the reason they are held in the regard they are is cause at the time they came out, they released something amazing and different. Had they not released that, they would have just been passed aside and another band would have taken their place in the influence department.

Could also argue I suppose that had they started with one of those 2, they would have still had some sort of influence, but not on the level of what they have now.

Hopefully you get what I am saying with this and it isn't just something that makes more sense in my head...

I think everyone knows what you're trying to say Bastard, but your assumption carries no validity worth the argument, I would stick to the actual (facts) related to the musical genealogy of the genres, bands, and artist.

I must say my friend, that your knowledge concerning bands that you are already familiar with is very "impressive" in the forums at times, to say the least.:D

It is a very cliched statement but I still maintain that if you could only have one 'metal' band in your collection it would be Black Sabbath always.

I played the album Paranoid for the first time in a couple of years a few days back and it still blew me away. It is not my favourite of theirs. I don't like the title track and Iron Man doesn't do a lot for me but the last 4 tracks are just insane. The drum patterns in Rat Salad. The chunky riffs in Hand Of Doom. The effortless tempo changes in Fairies Wear Boots and all this from a band that were literally making it up as they went along.

Masters Of Reality is probably my favourite album though. The tempo change on After Forever and the main riff on Into The Void have never been bettered in my eyes.