:laughing:

So I was thinking how I would rate each of the big 4's albums against each other.
I'm using 1990/91 as a cut of point because I've not really listened to much of any of those bands material since around then.

So in order of preference my list would be...

Slayer - Reign In Blood
Megadeth - Rust in Peace
Metallica - Master Of Puppets
Slayer - Seasons In The Abyss
Megadeth - Peace Sells
Metallica - Kill Em All
Anthrax - Among The Living
Slayer - South Of Heaven
Anthrax - Persistence Of Time
Metallica - Ride The Lightning
Anthrax - Spreading The Disease
Slayer - Show No Mercy
Megadeth - So Far So Good So What
Metallica - Black Album
Metallica - And Justice For All
Slayer - Hell Awaits
Megadeth - Killing Is My Business
Anthrax - Fistful Of Metal
Anthrax - State Of Euphoria

The time you cut off, is around the time with the exception of Slayer that these bands stopped doing thrash and moved into other areas with varying degrees of success. Its through the post 90/91 period that Slayer were the only band of these four still consistently putting out quality material (Then with Paul Bostaph on drums) Without doubt though, the best thrash band around at that time were Sepultura, whose "Arise" album came out in 91 and served as a stepping stone into the eventual groove metal sound. Another mention should go to Overkill who were going through their best period and "Horrorscope" is one mother of an album.

As for the list, the order is pretty good and would be a general consensus but "South of Heaven" "Ride the Lightning" and "...And Justice For All"- The flawed masterpiece should be higher IMO.

Well i'm of the controversial opinion that the reason And Justice For All is considered a 'flawed masterpiece' is because it is in fact utter utter crap.
The only reason it's not bottom is because somehow other bands made worse albums.

I don't really see what I would drop down to make way for South of Heaven & Ride the Lightning if I was to put them higher.

Personally I think Killing Technology ,Dimension Hatröss & Nothingface top anything by the likes of Exodus, Testament, Sepultura, Overkill, Kreator, Death Angel, Nuclear Assault or any other thrash band you want to mention.

...And Justice For All is an album that splits a lot of people!

Voivod`s progressive thrash sets them apart from the rest of the bunch, not necessarily better but different, and the three albums that you`ve mentioned are great releases and the group had the knack of choosing some interesting cover material as well (Pink Floyd and King Crimson) along with a Batman closer on one of the albums.

Slayer writes music that's fast, sloppy, aggressive, and entirely free of preachiness. It's just speed, and intensity. The fact they refuse to have any restraint in any regard gives them the edge gave them an edge that the other three lack. Point is, I think of the four, Slayer is the band that "got the point" the most.

Lyrically, it felt their was an admittance that what they were doing was not deep or profound. They didn't embarrass themselves by attempting to force themselves to be poetic. Kind of got the point that thrash was stupid(which I do not mean as an insult).

Which is why they'll always have an edge over the three. When you listen to Slayer it's evil, and nothing but evil. Plus, I think their better work hits a layer of discomforting chaos that the more chained, refined, and polished of the other three lack. Personally, I think this really shows on Hell Awaits, which I feel is a generally overlooked album. Considering the context of the purpose of thrash metal, and it's audience, they are the most effective, and as a listener, personally give me the most emotional satisfaction when in a "thrash mood".

Megadeth is a close second for the fact that I respect them for always maintaining their quality as a live band, and even if not churning out great new material, they don't ever really feel washed up. May be more skilled performers than Slayer, but feel very boxed in, and caged compared to Slayer's more chaotic tempo pushing works. 'Even if, they are probably the most technical of the four, they still fall short. Plus singing lines like "Sit in Granny's Rocking Chair" kind of hurt the aesthetic a little bit...

Metallica for third. Similar to Megadeth, and with a lot a lot less padding/b-side material. However, I think with songs like Holy Wars, Megadeth far trumps Metallica musically. I think Metallica's commercial success only comes from the fact they had a deeper relationship with the studio/production end than the other three. However, this kind of hurts them because of the ego in trying to be ahead of the game forced them to expose limitations in their songwriting. Point is, some people are good at trying to do experimental rock. Metallica just does not have the right sensibilities for it.

Anthrax, I only really liked 2.5 of their albums. I mean, as mentioned, Among the living is amazing, along with State of Euphoria, and half of whichever one Madhouse is on. The rest, however, always feels to me like they're just knocking off Metallica's "Kill Em' All" sound. I don't know, maybe I'm not listening hard enough.

Unrelated point on Anthrax, though, I've always felt pretty much all of their work, even Among the Living, is well trumped by the jokey side project of Scott Ian, Stormtrooper's of Death. Then again, I've only heard "Speak English, or Die".

Your order is also my order of the bands, and I always felt that Slayer "Got the Point" and never deviated too much away from it. I can see why people dislike them for this, but for me thrash has always just been about speed, aggression and power and that= Slayer. They`re a band I can listen to anyplace anywhere. They`re also the thrash band that laid down the groundwork for the death metal scene and I think that says it all about them as a band. Because of Slayer we had the death metal masters Death.

Apart from the association with Nuclear Assault (who clearly came from a Hardcore Punk background) I agree that Voivod pissed all over anything released after '88 and are ridiculously under appreciated.

And Justice For all is an over wrought piece of trash that bored me in '88 and still bores me now.

Overkill were a fun band with a punk attitude and Exodus unfortunately suffered through line up changes.

Kreator are a decent band though and sound unlike anyone else, which is no mean feat.

First Death Angel album though is a classic Urbs ;) Still sounds good today and full of attitude and fire.

Metallica were really only thrash from Kill 'Em All to ...And Justice For All, i do enjoy all of their albums, but they didn't stay thrash their whole career, slayer did, megadeth almost did. not really big on anthrax, exodus should be in a 'big 5'

For most of the 90's Megadeth didn`t do too much thrash.

Apart from "Bonded By Blood" Exodus weren`t really good enough music wise to warrant a big 5 accolade. Picking a popular thrash band from the same era, I would say that the discography of Testament was superior.

Indeed, however I think Testament really hit their stride in '99 with The Gathering, which plays more like a death metal album than thrash metal. Still it is cool seeing one of the old school Bay Area thrash bands keeping up with the times and experimenting in ways other than corporate sellout. Steve DiGiorgio's presence is really felt on that album, it's a shame that he only played for that one album because I think he could have really been a key member for the band.

Just looked this album up and found out Dave Lombardo is on it. Now I'll definitely have to check it out.

The Testament albums I had in mind were "The New Order" "The Ritual" and "The Gathering". The Gathering is probably the heaviest and most aggressive thing that I`ve heard by them. I seem to remember, they started the move to more death metal in style on the previous "Demonic" album.

Indeed:beer: "The Gathering" is by far the best Testament record, and finally placed Chuck Billy (or is it Billy Chuck?) and co. away from Metallica's shadow. This is by far their most brutal and technical record, but calling this a Testament record is kind of a misnomer since for this recording they were a short-lived supergroup consisting of Dave Lombardo, James Murphy as well as DiGiorgio. Lombardo bolted to rejoin Slayer, then the band fell apart.

Judging each of the big Four's first 5 records, I've come up with:

Metallica > Slayer > Megadeth ---- Anthrax didn't make the cut.

Kill'em All > Show No Mercy > Killing is my Business
Ride the Lightning > Peace Sells > Hell Awaits
Reign In Blood > Master of Puppets > So Far So Good
Rust In Peace > Justice For All > South of Heaven
Seasons in the Abyss > Countdown to Extinction > Metallica

Metallica = 2 number ones + 2 number twos + 1 number three
Slayer = 2 number ones + 1 number two + 2 number threes
Megadeth* = 1 number one + 2 number two + 2 number threes

*As a consolation for Megadeth, they've totally kicked the crap out of both Metallica and Slayer in judging they're last 3 albums. His new guitarist, Broderick is one of the best ever to sling for Megadeth and album, Endgames is up there with Mustaine's best work.

I agree with Unknown Soldier...Anthrax is completely generic and relied on gimmicks to gain attention. The gimmick I found most repulsive was that nu-metal rap song they did with that rapper...I think is was Public Enemy, I don't know...I'm trying to forget it.

you're thinking Bring The Noise with Chuck D. it's hardly a gimmick when you're the first ones to do it though at that point it's generally considered innovative. shocking! i know.

I don't think AJFA is trash, but I never understood the fascination with it. For me their first three were better.

Voivod is fantastic and easily the best proggy/techy thrash act - Coroner and Artillery were decent too. And there's a weirdo German band called Mekong Delta which actually managed to do the classical/thrash thing properly.

Most Metallica fans that I know of really like AJFA!!! and I also see it as the last great album by the group in their first phase despite its shoddy production. I`d rather listen to this album than the following Metallica album anytime.

Don't get me wrong, I like AJFA and it features Metallica at their best in places (Blackened, Dyers Eve and One) but a lot of it just feels too drawn out. Mind you, I haven't listened to it in a few years so perhaps it's due for re-evaluation?

Lets tweek this a little;)

Kill`em All> Show No Mercy> Killing is my Business
Ride the Lightning> Peace Sells> Hell Awaits
Master of Puppets> Reign in Blood> So Far So Good
Rust in Peace> And Justice For All> South of Heaven
Seasons in the Abyss> Countdown to Extinction> Metallica

The ten Essential thrash albums would be as follows and in no special order. Also including other groups in this early period of thrash as well:
Slayer-Seasons in the Abyss
Slayer-South Of Heaven
Slayer-Reign in Blood
Metallica-Master of Puppets
Metallica-Ride the Lightning
Megadeth-Rust in Peace
Megadeth-Countdown to Extinction
Anthrax-Among the Living
Exodus-Bonded By Blood
Overkill-Years of Decay

The essential releases by non anglophone bands would be:
Sepultura-Beneath the Remains
Sepultura-Arise
Voivod-Dimension Hatross
Voivod-Nothingface
Kreator-Coma of Souls

I`m sure I`ve forgotten some bands here.........

Long songs, overly complex and drawn out......sounds like a classic prog album.:p:

I agree and would actually go as far as saying I like And Justice For All a lot more than Kill 'Em All.

i wouldn't quite go that far but there's no denying the awesomeness of Dyer's Eve or Blackened.

Thanks for reminding me. You might be interested in this little 1986 ditty..Run-DMC & Aeromsith's - Walk This Way.

Hip Hop artists have had always used rock music in their music, Run DMC & Aerosmith was no different.

The difference was Anthrax working with Public Enemy was the first time a rock band had covered a hip hop song and not vice versa.

That's why it was groundbreaking.

Its a hard comparison as the very early thrash albums display a primordial primitive feel, that are almost a world away from albums like ....And Justice For All.

I don't know, I saw it as an attempt merge two audiences to capture a little cha-jing, cha-jing. I guess you can call it groundbreaking in the sense it laid the foundation for Nu-Metal and Korn.

And opened the doors to hip hop for white kids.

Over a decade later.

Anybody could point to any groundbreaking moment in music and say it was bad just because of what it spawned 10 years later.

Those are probably my two favorite songs on the album. :)

Testament's debut 'The Legacy' whilst rough around the edges is generally regarded as one of the best Thrash albums outside of the big four and rightly so. I personally think that they lost momentum with each subsequent album and regardless whether they dipped their toes into Death Metal later on, they had enough about them earl;y on to really make it. They made an album a couple of years back which was absolutely awful and stank of nu metal cheese and not in a pleasant, aromatic way either.

As for what Urban stated- he is entirely correct. Just because many bands turned out crap through utilising Hip Hop doesn't mean that the hybrid is without merit.

Both forms of music (discounting certain bands lyrics etc) are very similar. DIY music made in a garage and socially relavent.

I will still champion Mordred as the greatest and most influential band of this era though and many years above the usual contenders.

Despite "The Legacy" and its high regard I was never overly mad over it and preferred the following album "The New Order"

By the way, I`m not one of the people that has rubbished Anthrax on here, but just said they weren`t as good as the other big four in general, I even recognize "Among the Living" as one of the essential thrash albums of the era.

Mordred!!! Now there`s a long forgotten band.

Favourite of the Four
 

Hi, thought I'd find out who the forum thinks is the best band of the Big Four of thrash metal. Is it Metallica, Slayer, Megadeth or Anthrax? I am personally a big Metallica fan followed by Megadeth then Slayer. But what are your thoughts? Should there be one band replaced by Exodus or Testament? Or perhaps a 'Big 5'?

It's a toss up between Slayer and Megadeth. Metallica hasn't been thrash since the 80s and I've never been a fan of Anthrax.

Okay, you'll all have to help me here. What exactly is thrash? I mean, the way I have always looked at it is that Slayer is "death" metal not "thrash". And could anyone tell me besides Metallica's St. Anger, what other band(s/albums) are considered nu-metal? I know there's been mention that Slayer did that in Diabolus in Musica, which happens to be my favorite of Slayer's output - please, don't thrash me. Seems I've been led astray in what I've come to believe thrash is all about, which is madness as a theme, and speedy instrumentals, along with harsh singing, the latter two Slayer does indeed hit on hardest, though. As for madness, Metallica sings about betrayal (Master of Puppets) and madness/depression (Welcome Home, Frayed Ends of Sanity/Fade to Black), and endtimes (Blackend) and the supernatural (The Thing That Should not Be). Whereas Slayer is always singing about death, murder, etc. Slayer's overly obsessive lyrics deal mostly in death (Angel of Death comes to mind). Metallica is always about that which can cause death, but not necessarily the act in and of itself.

Metallica is my favorite of the 4. And I've never really made a big judgment call of their entering bluesy rock. 1st one I bought was Load. I love that album, but my favorite is Kill 'em All. But something funny about that is that it wasn't always my favorite. About a decade or so ago I used to think that the album sounded the same, every song except Seek & Destroy. But that one has indeed grown on me since, hence it has since become my favorite album of all time. Go figure.

And when it comes to Megadeth, my favorite album of theirs is Cryptic Writtings...GASP! I don't know, maybe I ain't as hardcore as I once thought I was. I guess I just have a bit further range of music appriciation - Garth Brooks' Ropin' the Wind is my 5th favorite album of all time. I know, I'm weird! Well, the last time I listened to it I still liked it alot. I mean, I know I really like the album, but I don't know, I should give it a listen here soon to see if it's still #5.

I remember reading a review of Anthrax's greatest hits CD, where it talks about their branching out to rap-metal, e.g., I'm the Man. I was almost sighing at the thought of another rap-metal song. But it turned out to be my most listened to by them. Weird, agian, I know. But I seem to break precidents within every medium.

Thrash is basically what happened in the early to mid 1980s after metal got a shot of hardcore punk in the arm: high energy, fast, aggressive music with shouted vocals and lyrics which frequently involved social commentary. Thrash gave birth to death metal in the mid to late 80s, and though some of Slayer's music was influential on death metal, Slayer themselves are not death metal. Listen to some Death, Obituary, Deicide, Suffocation, Immolation etc. if you want to hear what death metal sounds like. You'll find it's generally "thicker" sounding than thrash, with cookie monster vocals that are one of its defining characteristics.

Nu-metal is the sad result of grunge and rap blending into metal in the mid to late 90s. Its defining characteristics are downtuned guitars, an emphasis on groove, a lack of solos, much slower tempos than thrash or death metal and vocals with a noticeable rap or grunge influence. Some well known nu-metal bands are Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot, Sevendust and Papa Roach.

Besides Janszoon`s points, try looking at groove metal, you`ll probably enjoy it. It derived out of thrash and kind of sits between thrash metal and Nu-metal (soundwise) and is probably the heaviest of the three but not as fast as thrash. Best known bands are Pantera, Sepultura, White Zombie, Machine Head and Lamb of God. Most of these bands sound quite different so if you don`t like one, doesn`t mean that you won`t like the others.

Another death metal must listen are Morbid Angel. Also you may want to try the melodic death metal scene which is largely dominated by Swedish bands such as At the Gates, In Flames, Dark Tranquillity, Hypocrisy, Arched Enemy and Tiamat.

If you want a mind blowing heavy listen, check out Meshuggah`s "Destroy Erase Improve" It f**kin blew me into next week when I first listened to it.

Ah, I love Meshuggah. I only have two of their albums though (Nothing and ObZen). I'll have to give Destroy Erase Improve a listen.

I like all four of them, but I chose Metallica. Not because I necessarily listen all that much to Metallica, or because they've had the most commercial succes. But because their music is more varied and they are great musicians technically speaking. (the last part can be said for all four bands really). But it seems to me Metallica have a greater number of songs that really stand out.

Metallica is more mainstream than any of the other bands.

I like Metallica the best, really, despite their rampant selling out in the 90's. I think their 80's thrash stuff is the cream of the crop. Truth be told, I don't even particularly like Megadeth very much outside of one or two albums. Slayer are better, though. Haven't heard enough Anthrax to call judgment on them.