boo boo

k E nnyneverdied: Proof MB sucks: There is an entire thread about the quality degenerating and the few people who seem to be sticking to their guns about the greatness of the site are the mods.
CrappyGuitar18: MB's decline in quality started when I stopped posting in the music threads (=
k E nnyneverdied: It started when I got banned.
CrappyGuitar18: still banned?
k E nnyneverdied: Yeah
k E nnyneverdied: I don't see getting unbanned happening but Tor made an interesting post.
CrappyGuitar18: he brought it up?
k E nnyneverdied: Kinda sorta.
k E nnyneverdied: Vegangelica brought it up and he responded.
k E nnyneverdied: As for the Unfan and turning permbans into tempbans, I think that discussion would be more appropriate in the Announcements, Suggestions, & Feedback forum.
CrappyGuitar18: i still haven't talked to anyone about it but I need to PM a mod and at least ask if your ban is supposed to be permanent or not and why
k E nnyneverdied: Honestly, it doesn't matter. I doubt if I'd post if I were unbanned. Why should I be part of a community which has degenerated due to poor modship?
k E nnyneverdied: And yes, that is really why I think MB lost a lot of its appeal but people aren't bringing it up.
k E nnyneverdied: The few times I mentioned the ****ty mod job I was called a troll by the mods.
CrappyGuitar18: that's because they're afraid
CrappyGuitar18: lol
CrappyGuitar18: but I have nothing against the others
CrappyGuitar18: they all tried their best to help me during my little crisis and I'm greatful for that
CrappyGuitar18: and by crisis I mean you
CrappyGuitar18: lol
k E nnyneverdied: Also I think Tor's post is interesting because I mentioned a few warnings and bans and the mods accused me of trolling and told me to stay out of it.
k E nnyneverdied: In fact, I didn't even like coryallen, but I still tried to argue against him being banned.
CrappyGuitar18: i dont think anyone liked coryallen
CrappyGuitar18: but he didnt really deserve a ban
CrappyGuitar18: he wasnt a troll
k E nnyneverdied: That doesn't mean he did anything wrong. Not being liked shouldn't be bannable.
CrappyGuitar18: just a total ****wad
k E nnyneverdied: I would care a lot less if the mods didn't pride themselves on fairness.
k E nnyneverdied: But the mods don't hold up MB's policies, and if they do its very inconsistantly.
k E nnyneverdied: coryallen was banned for flooding. Vanilla starts roughly 50984098089430984 times the threads coryallen does and she hasn't gotten even as much as a warning as far as I know.
k E nnyneverdied: Also MB has a no sexual content clause and Vanilla's biggest thread was about sex.
k E nnyneverdied: Oops, looks like Vanilla should be ****ing banned.
k E nnyneverdied: But no, the mods like her so she won't be.
CrappyGuitar18: well
k E nnyneverdied: Mod favoritism is the reason MB is such a ****ty community.
CrappyGuitar18: the sexual content clause is stupid
k E nnyneverdied: I agree that it is stupid.
CrappyGuitar18: everyone posts on her thread
k E nnyneverdied: But it isn't my site nor my rules.
CrappyGuitar18: so everyone should be banned by that logic
CrappyGuitar18: well
CrappyGuitar18: i should tell them about that
k E nnyneverdied: Either the MB mods need to change the rules, or ban Vanilla.
CrappyGuitar18: if you're not gonna obey the rules, get rid of them
k E nnyneverdied: There is no consistancy between the rules and what they deem ban worthy.
k E nnyneverdied: MB has no standard so of course it all comes down to favorites.
CrappyGuitar18: change the rule to "no explict sexual images" or something
CrappyGuitar18: that is kinda true
k E nnyneverdied: Which is precisely how I think I got outed.
k E nnyneverdied: The mods got sick of me calling them on their nonsense and banned me over pointing out their flaws.
k E nnyneverdied: I WAS A BETTER MODS THAN THE MODERATORS AND I WAS ACCUSED OF TROLLING FOR KNOWING THE RULES BETTER THAN THEY DO
k E nnyneverdied: If that isn't bull**** I don't know what is.
CrappyGuitar18: well I like vanilla, so I should tell them that the rules need to be changed
CrappyGuitar18: because it's a stupid rule
k E nnyneverdied: Personally I don't like Vanilla, but the reason I don't like Vanilla is because she didn't like me because I didn't like you.
CrappyGuitar18: oh
CrappyGuitar18: ?
CrappyGuitar18: well
CrappyGuitar18: maybe she'd be nicer to you if she knew that we got along now
CrappyGuitar18: lol
k E nnyneverdied: In fact, you might as well post my rant on lack of standards in the Quality Of MB Decreasing thread because that is precisely the problem.
k E nnyneverdied: If there is no community standard the community is inable to be approached reasonably.

Little convo I had with Unfan, who actually does raise some good points. I think some of the rules are worthless since nobody enforces them, I'm not attacking any of the mods here, it's just a suggestion.

Also, is Unfan's ban a permanent one and if so why?

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It's only knock n' knowall, but I like it

http://www.last.fm/user/kingboobs

Guybrush

Some of the discussion is addressing inconcistencies in the way the site is moderated and the rules. Actually, there is no rule against sexual content anymore. It was removed quite some time ago basically because of the points you guys mentioned. The rules in general were revised and improved.

If the sexual content rule is still around, then there's a rule thread somewhere which has not been updated and if so, it's a simple error on our part.

As for the rest of the discussion, it might bring up some points but they may also be highly biased. It would perhaps be interesting to ask the community in general if they think permabans of some of our members has decreased the quality of the site. Another interesting question one could ask now is ; moderation is done in a very general rather than set way, different mods moderate in somewhat different ways. There are pros and cons, one big pro is that people who are generally nice are generally not moderated as much - people are given some amount of freedom as long as they behave. On the other hand, moderation becomes more personal, there could be favoritism - it basically opens up for human error. Although I think it's ultimately something for the mod team to sort out, I wouldn't mind a discussion on this in it's own thread if people have some strong ideas concerning this.

Because people are asking about the unfan, I can say that he's been permabanned indefinetly because he has a history of insulting other members and getting moderated which included tempbanning which he nevertheless didn't seem to learn much from.

• Reason: Insulted Other Member(s)
• Reason: Insulted Other Member(s)
• Reason: Insulted Other Member(s)
• Reason: trolling
• Reason: Off-topic insults
• Reason: Unprovoked personal insults towards a moderator.
• Reason: If this doesn't deserve a warning, nothing does.

Those are things from his registered moderation history, but you also have to remember that a lot of moderation goes on in the background over PMs. I have nothing personal against The Unfan, but I don't think his permaban should come as a surprise to anyone. He's a repeat offender and likely will continue to be if he ever comes back.

edit :

If you have any opinions on points brought up in the last two posts, please check out this thread : http://www.musicbanter.com/announcem...moderated.html

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Something Completely Different

boo boo

Well, for once I do agree with Unfan that MB is playing favorites, I honestly can't think of any reason why Unfan is more worthy of a permaban than say Captain Caveman.

I guess Caveman's excuse is that he didn't piss off Big3, which is what Unfan claims.

Then why does Caveman get away scott free?

Caveman continues to do all of these things on a grand scale.

I just think there should be consistency, there are worse repeat offenders on this forum than Unfan, if you're gonna ban him for his track record, others should be punished too.

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It's only knock n' knowall, but I like it

http://www.last.fm/user/kingboobs

Guybrush

Personally right now without checking up on his latest post history, I have a general feeling that CC has improved his act significantly. Looking at the numbers, CC has recieved 1 warning/infraction the last 5 months while The Unfan has recieved 4.

None of these were given by Big3 either if you think that matters.

I think when you discuss with The Unfan, you should remember that you're discussing with someone who most likely doesn't see or denies their own faults. The numbers are likely a more reliable source than he is.

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Something Completely Different

music_phantom13

While you're talking about bans, I have a quick question. Here's a post by someone who chose the name jazz, presumably just so that people here will assume he has some interest in music.

My question is, why not just ban users like this immediately? If this is the first and only post she has made so far, I think it's very unlikely that she will contribute anything of any use whatsoever. And if she should decide she wants to talk about music, she could always send a pm to a mod telling them so and asking them to remove her ban. Seems to me this just leaves us with a really long list of users who could potentially come back to waste more of our time with stupid ass threads like this. It doesn't really decrease the quality of MB though, it's just a bit annoying.

TheBig3

Unfan wishes he pissed me off. He took a cheap shot in a thread about pedophiles and got mad that the other mods had had enough of his ****.

But we've been through this before. Big3's a nasty jerk so its every trolls dream to unseat him.

Unfan contributed nothing to this forum and he spent his time trying to badger me. If he wants to post freely have him create a Big3 sucks forum. He has no function here.

Edit: And again for the record, my infraction list is probably the smallest of the mods.

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I've moved to a new address

Bulldog

Also for the record, Big3 didn't ban the Unfan in the first place, so that's that argument out the window.

VEGANGELICA

Thanks, Tore, for the link to the thread. I've posted my suggestions in your new poll thread in the Announcements-Suggestions-Feedback section.

I agree that it is troubling if it is true that one person can express concern about a permanent ban (as I did about The Unfan's) but another person's input (The Unfan's defense of coryallen) is not welcome. One question is always *how* the concern is expressed. I do recall Unfan saying in a thread he felt moderators were trolls (because they were calling other people trolls, if I recall correctly).

Hi Big3, I also saw some of The Unfan's misbehaviors (namecalling) and wished he would stop (since I think he knew what not to say...and I was afraid he was going to get banned), but for the record I do not feel it is accurate to say he contributed nothing positive to this forum. The Unfan contributed positively to my experience on the forum. He certainly seemed to know a lot about music and musicians and had/has a strong interest in music, which I admired. Yes, his personality could be ascerbic...yet also directly honest. So, for me his permabanning was a disappointment, even as I recognize that those people whom he attacked verbally are probably relieved. I write more about this whole issue of moderating and permabans in Toretorden's thread/poll.

--Erica

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Guybrush

coryallen was also a bit of a special case. Before he was banned, he was given a lot of leeway and an X number of chances by the moderators. Quite possibly, that X should be a double digit. It's not that he was a bad kid, he meant well and sent me PMs if I could help him with his homework or if he was going to die from his tick-bite. The sad truth, though, is that I've never ever seen a member who created so much work for the moderators as coryallen. Regular members like The Unfan don't see all the vast number of PMs and deleted posts and threads. Personally, I thought moderating him was a bit like kicking a puppet, but I support the decision to ban him as he was extremely disruptive to basically everything that goes on here - and that never really changed, he never learned.

Anyways, he had more valiant defenders than the Unfan. Many of the mods at the time like Right-Track and Jackhammer stood up for him time and time again.

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Something Completely Different

right-track

The difference between The Unfan and CAPTAIN CAVEMAN is very simple.
When CC recieves an infraction, or a temp ban, he responds positively.
The Unfan, on the other hand, struggled to accept a moderators decision and often reacted negatively. On no occasion would he accept a decision.
He never learnt despite repeated warnings and countless chances.

Just for the record, I didn't ban him. The mod who did gets my full support on making the right decision.