Religion, War and Violence
 

I don't know if a thread like this has been created elsewhere at all but I couldn't find one so here we go:

I share a lot of views with New Atheists (though I myself am not Atheist) that organized religion is both directly and indirectly a cause of most all wars. What do you all think about it?

I agree.

I think people should do a lot of research. Know your bible history so when the bible gets thrown in your face you can have an intelligent counterpoint to tell people...The bible is more myth than fact but it can still have merit. It is people who take it literally who get me. Because they mostly don't know the books history. I beleieve in something bigger that me...I am just not quite sure what it is yet...and I won't know until I die...And violence in the name of religion is a lame excuse to kill people who are different than you...Didn't Jesus teach understanding and love? ANd wasn't he Middle Eastern?

I believe Jesus to be a schizophrenic, the bible to be nothing more than moral codes designed to maintain order and stability, and to quote Niezstche, the church to be hostile to the true nature of life.

Same applies to Judaism and Islam. And im against the hierachies created through Hiduism.

That said, im not against all religion. I appreciate the core teachings of Buddhism and its point of bettering yourself from within. That is, however, pretty much it.

Yes, I like what everyone is saying. The part that does it for me is how Christians, and many other groups, can claim to be the ONLY ones who are right. What makes them so sure? And what do they think of the people who have never been exposed to Christianity?

Also, I'm thinking about getting into Bahai... can anyone relate or anything?

Thats the fundamental problem i think, each of these dominant world religions preach that their way is that of the all-knowing, all-consuming truth. Of course conflict is going to arise.

I just think people who believe in this tripe either seriously lack the confidence to take on life in its true form, are full of fear or are just plain stupid.

Well said.

2 outta three ain't bad.

I have a couple friends who are Baha'i. The beliefs are just as kooky as any other religion but it's a very tolerant religion that has promoted gender and racial equality since long before it was cool to do so. The down sides: Baha'is are not allowed to drink alcohol and the religion, like a lot of religions, is kind of anti-gay. They'll dance around the issue all day long, but when it comes down to it the religion opposes same-sex relationships.

Personally, I'm more of a fan of the Unitarian-Universalists. They're more tolerant and open than the Baha'is and more about community and philosophy than they are about doctrine.

human nature is the cause of all wars, religion is an afterthought

New Atheists, as oppose to old ones?

We will unfortunately always be at war over something, I think the future holds less wars on religious issues, more on the depleting environmental resources.. Religion is however to blame for millions of deaths and human rights abuses, not just through wars.

No alcohol? Well that's no good. I read about their openness to all religions and such and I have a friend in it so I was just wondering. I'll have to do some research on Unitarian Universalists.

Yes, that is the name of the movement, The New Atheist Movement... look it up.

The New Atheists is the name for the current crop of atheist writers and intellectuals, people like Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris.

violence is a natural response that should'nt be repressed.
violence is the greatest motivator on the face of the planet.


it is strange to me that weakness and indecision are glorified in the public sphere.

I'm sure you'd change your view should you become a victim of violence.

if you choose your role as a transgressor you're less likely to become a victim

Of what? Of violence?

yeah

I think history might disagree with you CA.

The holocaust for the win!!! Lets go wear shirts that say Yay Darfur next!!!

well even in the cases where the transgressor becomes the victim it's only to give way to a new transgressor so in the end the scales are still tipped

There's a time for violence when acting against an aggressor, or aggressors.
I really wouldn't recommend being an aggressor though...it usually ends in tears.

all sex is rape

:laughing:

Violence is the inability to rise up above your animalistic predecessors. To be violent is to display the fact that you are a lesser being.

Level headedness and the ability to solve problem's with one's brain are glorified. Humans are the dominant species because of our brains, not our brawn. Non-violence is a strength my friend.

^^ actually roaches are the dominant species

Nah, not until we blow ourselves up ;)

Actually dogs are the dominant species. They're the only ones I see with servants running around after them, cleaning up their poop and putting it in plastic bags.

that says more about us than it does about them

I know it's slightly tongue in cheek but Dogs represent Man's ultimate manipulation of a species. We tamed them and created breeds entirely for own good and not theirs. The poor old Chihuahua has to give birth by caeseran section because she is too small to do it naturally. I find this a little fucked up.

Genuine apologies I have gone off topic.

I am going to go with Ayn Rand's view that irrationality is what causes wars. People choose to forget about the non-aggression axiom.

Those are the people that start the wars in the name of religion.

"We jews know it wasn't created in 7 days. And we know this because we know what we're really good at, and that's bull ****. I would love to believe the Earth was created in 7 days... but I have thoughts. And that can really F#ck up the faith thing, just ask any Catholic priest." -Lewis Black.


Well, really, I am agnostic, which is like being between believing and not believing.
And it's amazing how many crusades are fought in the name of one God or another, and how many arguments rise up because someone is defending their religious beliefs.

i have no sympathy for any group of people that allow themselves to be systematically killed or persecuted willingly, and without substantial and serious rebellion.. it is a far better thing to die in defense of your personal liberty than under the will of your lessers.

Because we all know how easy it is to fight people with guns when they break down your door and you're still in your nightie.

i forgot that it only took one night to round up millions of people, transport and keep them in concentration camps, and kill them in their pajamas.

must have slipped my mind.

Yeah that was definitely my point. You're clearly not understanding what I'm saying. It's absurd to generalize that all the Jews were in the positions to effectively rally against the Nazis. The only thing more absurd then that is saying you have no sympathy for them because they weren't rebellious enough for you during the holocaust. Oh wait...

Why talk to anticipation about this...(s)he is far too immature to discuss anything without condescension.

Haha.. did you get this off Seinfeld? :D

What's the deal with that?

I knew you were awesome.