Originally Posted by Hip-Hop Homework

The simple fact that you take a position of authority in asserting there is no fundamental set of beliefs opens the floor for the argument that there is some authoritative source to support your claim (if you wanna claim credibility) and that in turn supports the notion that there is a structure from which you derive your authority...you know, something upon which a foundation is built--ergo fundamental.

Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien

There is only one bright spot and that is the growing habit of disgruntled men of dynamiting factories and power-stations; I hope that, encouraged now as ‘patriotism’, may remain a habit! But it won’t do any good, if it is not universal.

Originally Posted by The Batlord

What on earth are you talking about? I am making a claim based on logic and observation. Whatever the hell you just said is simply incoherent nonsense.



I'm seeing your point fine. What you are failing to see is that using the same word to describe both Christianity and the scientific community dilutes the meaning of the word to the point that it becomes useless as a descriptor. If you wanna call them both a religion, then you need at least two other, different words to fall under the umbrella of the definition of "religion".

Language is meant to define objects and ideas, not draw vague, tenuous links between two otherwise unrelated objects/ideas.

Originally Posted by Chula Vista

I hate the use of the word beliefs in regard to hard science. Does one have a belief in gravity? Or atomic energy? Or a person's white blood cell count and how it relates to cancer?

Belief @ Dictionary.com

noun
1.
something believed; an opinion or conviction:
a belief that the earth is flat.
2.
confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof:
a statement unworthy of belief.
3.
confidence; faith; trust:
a child's belief in his parents.
4.
a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith:
the Christian belief.

The only people I encounter who refer to science as a belief system are those who question its validity in relation to evolution and God in general.

Originally Posted by Chula Vista

I hate the use of the word beliefs in regard to hard science. Does one have a belief in gravity? Or atomic energy? Or a person's white blood cell count and how it relates to cancer?

Belief @ Dictionary.com

noun
1.
something believed; an opinion or conviction:
a belief that the earth is flat.
2.
confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof:
a statement unworthy of belief.
3.
confidence; faith; trust:
a child's belief in his parents.
4.
a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith:
the Christian belief.

The only people I encounter who refer to science as a belief system are those who question its validity in relation to evolution and God in general.

Originally Posted by Hip-Hop Homework

The merriam-webster copyright expired some years ago so it's no longer the authority it once was as now anybody can print a dictionary flying under that banner; I haven't taken the time to understand how this might impact their website and its sources but I seldom use it. I find its definitions tend to be somewhat dated compared to dictionary.com's.

I prefer dictionary.com as it maintains its library of definitions quite well and I believe is a credible, authoritative source.

let's see what they have to say...

noun
1.
a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.
2.
a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects:
the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
3.
the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices:
a world council of religions.
4.
the life or state of a monk, nun, etc.:
to enter religion.
5.
the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.
6.
something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience:
to make a religion of fighting prejudice.


The way I see it, Iunno aboutchu, atheism fits the bill for 4/6 of the nuanced definitions. As you can see, when you consider the word as a whole, and you don't have to but I would...I don't think there's any point of contention that atheism isn't a religion. The million-dollar question is how to objectively prove atheists adhere to a specific set of beliefs or practices but I just observe the same practice atheists use for observers of other religions--personal experience. However, I acknowledge that even within a community you will not find the uniform mentality, behavior, or adherence many people would have us believe by making statements with sweeping generalizations, or painting with broad strokes if you will.

I raise the argument that atheism is a religion because many atheists/agnostics contend Christians (few are honest enough to acknowledge exception) are the same, as though that somehow allows for an objective observation knowing fully-well people vary on a case-by-case basis, at the biological level no less and all the more when it comes to creeds and ethics, even within a culture. So to say a people or a culture are all a certain way with no deviation is kinda foolish to me and doesn't stand up to logical inquiry when it comes to definition. Atheists are supposed to be champions of empirical evidence yet somehow I find that lacking in many of the suppositions you'll find in atheists dogma. It's more of a religion than you might have ever paused to acknowledge and I don't claim that to provoke anybody's sensibilities--given the definition I know, I recognize that the atheistic community fits the description and I ain't gonna deny that. I prefer to be equitable in the treatment of all parties that are subject to the debate.

You're asking questions but not returning any insight on your beliefs so I am starting to feel preachy so I'ma stay quiet as kept and politely excuse myself. This it not to be dismissive of anything with which you might reply. So don't take it that way...I'll respect your inputs but I just prolly won't reply any further.

You don't think Atheism is a religion and I do; I'm cool with that.

Originally Posted by Janszoon

After all that hemming and hawing, you finally provide what you feel are the "strict" definitions of religion... and they don't fit atheism, as Batlord covered pretty fully.

I see you have some sort of gripe about people judging Christians or something but it's irrelevant to whether or not atheism is a religion. It isn't one, according to your own definitions. You can pretend it's one all want, and you pretend fish are hair dyers as well if you'd like, but what's the point?

Originally Posted by Hip-Hop Homework

cool story, bro! Have your people call my people and we can set up another time for you to perform d-bags on parade...

hahaha, I'm just kidding. But seriously...

I took this from the source you referenced earlier. You can find it here:

Religion | Definition of Religion by Merriam-Webster

I'm clearly the one who is misunderstanding the idea of what a religion is.

If you expect me to be the bigger man and not hold you accountable to your own standards of reason while you willfully walk in denial, just a fair warning--YOU'RE IN FOR A HUUUUGE DISAPPOINTMENT!!!

Wow, Food, you're a religion too? IS THERE ANYTHING YOU CAN'T DO?!

Again...their words--not mine.

No big deal tho, just a dictionary but who cares what a dictionary says around here?