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I believe pepper spray at point blank range can at worst permanently damage your eyes, so it looks to me like that cop is exaggerating.
I don't know the story here, but don't people in US have a right to protest peacefully without getting pestered by the police? I have a feeling that had that been in Norway, the police would likely be watching the "perimeter" and making sure none of the protesters got hurt.
What I mean is, if nazis were outside parliament protesting here, then the police here would show up to make sure no one else attack them. You know, protect the protesters right to protest. Why are they getting involved up there?
Well in the UC Davis case, those were University Police. Not even the town cops, which are fairly herp-derp themselves (though, yes, some are nice and proper - many are not).
Apparently the chancellor wanted them removed. The chancellor of the UC system wanted the protesters off her lawn. They had set up a protest that day to show solidarity with their sister school's protesters at famous UC Berkeley. Protesters at UC Berkeley were thrashed a bit and sprayed with pepper spray. And Berkeley used to be the hotbed of protest. So back on track, the students AND faculty that cared were showing solidarity and they ironically were also pepper-sprayed. Somewhere along the line, things changed to the point where peaceful assembly and protesting is not okay. And I don't really know when that happened. It's pretty sad.
Also, that "pepper spray" is dark orange because it is bear mace. I make sure to call it what it is. It's not simply pepper spray, which is bad enough. One of the students was throwing up blood for 15 minutes after being sprayed. They endured not one round, but two. First, how is the officer (shown in the video for frame of reference) going to walk up and spray them while they're sitting there quietly? Isn't there another procedure? Like cuff them and lead them away one by one? [Try leaving them alone would be the best answer in this case]. Two, you've sprayed them already. They're feeling the effects. You go for round two with the spray? How is that not over the top? It's debatable if the first one was necessary, but the second round surely was not called for.
In other settings where the police/riot police have been called to deal with protesters like the Occupy in New York at Wall St., or at Oakland, CA, I can't comment extensively on. But in most cases it seems as if the police will make false flag antagonism to give reason to shut them down with force, It used to be you could protest and not expect to be harmed or injured by the police because of it. But those days, for now, are gone it seems.
Yeah, I agree that the guy who did the pepper spraying was way out of line. What people can forget though is just how frightening it can be to have a large group of people surround you and shout at you. They may not be taking any further action, but it's unnerving. Not only that, but I'd bet most police members have either witnessed or been taught about what happens when a crowd gets out of control. All it can take is just one thing, even just a sign of weakness on the part of the police, and it can get reaaalllly vicious. To use a rather extreme example (hey, both sides can play that game :P) The London Riots had some... interesting moments, like this one:
The line holds, and nothing really happens. The line steps back, and all hell breaks loose. Now I realise this isn't a particularly accurate comparison to (most of) the Occupy protests, but these were happening around the same time (the riots were a little earlier), and just the thought, the possibility that if they lost control, something like that might happen would be more than enough to prey on the minds of ordinarily alright police men and women, and perhaps press them into unwise decisions.
It always saddens me how quick the "student idealists" (as I tend to think of them) put all the blame for any acts of aggression on the police force, as if they're meant to be some superhumanly calm and wise collection of the best of humanity. I see it all the time, coming from friends who I consider quite intelligent. For some reason, when "The Man" comes into the equation, the concept of reality seems to go right out the window :/
__________________ "I found it eventually, at the bottom of a locker in a disused laboratory, with a sign on the door saying "Beware of the Leopard". Ever thought of going into Advertising?"
I don't know the story here, but don't people in US have a right to protest peacefully without getting pestered by the police? I have a feeling that had that been in Norway, the police would likely be watching the "perimeter" and making sure none of the protesters got hurt.
What I mean is, if nazis were outside parliament protesting here, then the police here would show up to make sure no one else attack them. You know, protect the protesters right to protest. Why are they getting involved up there?
Unless California has radically different laws than the various states wherein I attended college... that college is, although supported by public funds, a legal entity seperate from Government administrations. Meaning, the University and it's grounds are considered private property. As such their ability to protest there is contigent on the consent of the persons who own/manage the property. (EDIT) So, if the University duly notified them to stop protesting & disperse, they were free to remove the protestors. Should the protestors feel the University overstepped their bounds, they are free to pursue action via the civil and/or criminal courts.
That's quite the post. I disagree with about all of it, but I'm going to limit my response to a few things. I underlined what I'm responding to in order to make this clearer for all,
In regards to my first underline; you both acknowledge that police do have to arrest and deal with people you label "rabid, dangerous animals" while simultaneously denouncing their ability to imprison.
Further, I'd point out that police do not have the ability to detain people indefinitely nor to issue sentences.
In regards to the second underlined point; drug users are violating the law, as such they should be arrested. If you've issue with the law itself, fine, but that's a different point entirely because police are charged with enforcing the law.
Anyways, I like the police; they keep drunks off the road, bust drug dealers, and apprehend thieving bastards. I approve of all these activities.
They uphold many illogical laws that I don't agree with, I specifically stated that. Because of that, I question anybody by default who chooses to become police officers. Its guilty until proven innocent, due to the nature of the culture of it. I as well stated that I respect honest police officers.
If you want to live in a fantasy that most of them are indeed honest and not organized crime/bullies enabled by an imaginary line of authority, then I would feel sorry for you, but I can't because you're apart of the problem.
Most of them are criminals with a badge. Upholding laws created by ineptly elected criminals and breaking those same laws all of the time, while abusing their imaginary authority line.
Get real. If martial law goes down, they aren't there to serve and protect and aren't impartial. They'll beat you down and cart you off to a hell ridden zoo full of incorrigible animals that were as much created by the system they work for as anything else.
Theres no excuse for the cops spraying those kids. If they were being circled and felt threatened, then they should have just pushed through the circle. And if someone pushed back and got aggressive, then spray them. I don't see how thinking - "they're circling us. I feel threatened, let's spray these kids who are sitting on the ground" - is justifiable in any way. Aren't they supposed to be "keepers of the peace"? Instead these cops went into a peaceful situation and opened a can of whoop-ass. Actually, a can of pepper spray.
This is a subject near and dear to my heart as my BFF was killed by police December 2009. He was unarmed, sober, mentally ill and not charged with any crime. He had no criminal record
Yes, police do exceedingly difficult dangerous work. That is NOT a licence to injure, maim and kill with impunity anytime someone or something sets 'em off.
This is a long video but it's important to watch this whole thing. What the maker of this video is asserting is that there are police that stop being"protect and serve" and become the attackers. They become the criminals. It happens and a much more frequent rate than many people realize
I've always handled myself pretty well around cops. I've talked back or complained a few times about getting the pat-down or having to pour out an open container but for the most part *my* experience with cops has... well, they weren't totally negative. Definitely have some power-tripping mother****ers that just want you to respect their authorituh and don't really care about much else. There's some slacker mother****ers, too, who just don't do ****. I do know of people who had to deal with officer brutality, especially in the east bay. No one really close, though. And I remember when the Oscar Grant shooting happened people being utterly terrified of police. So I'm not saying police brutality isn't a part of my life, but I've never dealt with it.
__________________
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This is a subject near and dear to my heart as my BFF was killed by police December 2009. He was unarmed, sober, mentally ill and not charged with any crime. He had no criminal record
Yes, police do exceedingly difficult dangerous work. That is NOT a licence to injure, maim and kill with impunity anytime someone or something sets 'em off.
This is a long video but it's important to watch this whole thing. What the maker of this video is asserting is that there are police that stop being"protect and serve" and become the attackers. They become the criminals. It happens and a much more frequent rate than many people realize
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