I can't really wrap my head around it. I mean, I feel guilty for killing bugs. To think someone could kill one child, let alone THAT many people? It's unfathomable. I know the whole gun issue is going to come up quite a bit. I don't think we should just get rid of them all, because that doesn't do any good. Drugs are illegal, people still find ways to get drugs. Prohibition? That did a lot of good too. I think they need more strict control, and SOME kind of way to keep anyone that's even remotely unstable from getting their hands on one.

All I know about it is that no other equivalent country has this problem on this scale. Obviously something is wrong.

I agree with this...I know its unreasonable to think guns can just go away.

If every gun shop had an on hand psychologist maybe?

I think I deserve to own a gun because I went through extensive gun classes and training to learn the proper use and maintaining of my weapon. I look at my weapon as a recreational hobby that is designed to kill people. So I would be safe if a criminal breaks into my house with a gun and I pull out a knife?

I don't take it as an attack just probing me for answers and its perfectly fine. I think its pointless and enraging also. I still will always side with my right as a citizen to bear arms, albeit I have never had to.

For real.

Where will this supposed large supply of guns come from if not for U.S. manufacturing? Mexico gets the lion's share of their weapons from us because they have really strict gun laws making it very difficult to get your hands on one.

That'd probably be good. I can't really think of/figure out a surefire way, of course, since I know pretty much nothing about the process of getting a gun, but something along those lines I imagine would help. All I know is whatever is being done now isn't enough.

Well, I'll lay off since you don't want to talk about it anymore. There are few issues in the world that get me heated, and this is one of them.

I don't look down or judge anyone who is responsible and owns a gun. A lot of my friends (and family members, for that matter) own guns. In my eyes, not having a gun would simply be a reasonable sacrifice if it meant preventing a shooting like this. As we've all agreed, banning guns wouldn't get rid of guns. But we do have to start somewhere.

Why do you guys think school shootings are a relatively new ordeal in U.S?

Why wasn't it a issue pre 1990's?

edit: im wrong

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shooting#1700s

edit#2: still most of these are single shootings up until very recently

If you start a war on guns it will be about as effective as the war on drugs or the days of prohibition. You can't predict unpredictability, and even if a person gives off red flags as to being unstable the truth of it is Joe blow down the street who's been normal his whole life might flip out one day and do something extreme. The chances are less likely but point is these type of things have occurred since the beginning of time. Its frustrating and extremely sad for the victims but I think a war on guns would only make things worse. I don't know where the rest of you are from but I'm pretty sure as far as Texas and the rest of the south is concerned. You try to start taking their guns away and you would have a revolution on your hands. It would only lead to more devastation.

I've been over this issue so many times with family members. My own Mom is a proponent for gun laws and the banning of weapons. I found my love of guns from my grandfather and father, both military men and it has been an avid hobby for both collecting and recreational use for me for over 20 years now.

Well if banning guns wouldn't get rid of guns then we would be back at square one in a sense. I see the correlation you're painting, but its not gonna stop senseless violence. As I described a deranged guy made a weapon out of a car and killed 12 children at an elementary school here in California years ago. I just don't see banning guns as keeping guns out of the wrong hands. Who oversees this project and how do they get the guns from people who do not want to give up their guns? That would require taking away other rights in order to enforce something like that. OK I'm really done now.

It may just be that it's easier to log now with the internet, whereas earlier in the 80s and 90s, there wasn't a wikipedia to immediately upload news to.

I am so stunned by this complete tragic news. I am sadden for the victims for this sad situation. May GOD be with them. GOD bless America.

I'm not sure if that's true actually, because I'm not sure what an equivalent country to the US is. In terms of size (both in terms of land and population) Russia and Brazil are two of the closest equivalents to the US, and both have a substantially higher homicide rate.

This may be a teensy bit inappropriate and I apologize in advance but

where the **** was "GOD" when the children were being murdered?

Oh, he just wanted them to join in his kingdom of Heaven early :usehead:


Cause who cares how the parents feel?

It wasn't that long ago we had Derrick Bird and Raoul Moat on the loose here in England, the former killed around 13 people and the 2nd killed 1, injuring two more I think. They were within weeks of each other. Then we had Dunblane in the 90's and another massacre in 1987 though I can't remember the name, so it does happen here too.

I think it's a mix of being pushed over the edge and American gun laws.

That would be Michael Ryan in Hungerford

Hungerford massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Listen to me. GOD is good all the time in my opinion. I pray to what I call mighty GOD to protect the survivors of this sad tragedy.

Thanks. Hungerford, that's the one. Before I was born though.

I believe the idea that if guns are outlawed, criminals will still have them at the same frequency, is basically wrong. I think in a society where the regular guy won't be able to legally own a gun, a lot of people who would commit criminal acts won't have guns either. One reason could be that, despite them doing something criminal, they don't have criminal connections that can get them a gun prior to the criminal act. As an example, let's say two guys crash their cars and they start a fight. If one of them has a gun in the car, that fight could escalate and become a murder. If none of them have a gun, the likelyhood of things going that far decreases.

Also, if noone has guns, a criminal may not need that kind of power to f.ex rob someone. The threat of a knife or unarmed violence could be enough. Or maybe, lacking guns, they'll more often opt for criminal activities which do not require confrontations.

So I'm a big believer that less guns in society in general means less violence and less guns in the hands of criminals. When I'm sober, I'm sure I can find some studies to back that up.

With tears in my eyes, there are literally no words.

Its harder to get on a plane with a gun than in an elementary school. Maybe we ought to lock schools down like prisons.

No, there should be stricter laws regarding gun ownership and usage.

I agree with Burning Down but Right Wing fools won't let that happen anytime soon.

I also think there should be stricter security at schools. Where I come from, there are cops in middle schools and high schools. Why? Mainly to deal with any misbehaving kids. There aren't cops in elementary school because teachers can usually deal with kids these ages. I think that should change. I think all schools should have some kind of police or security on hand. You can just walk into any school around here. Of course, you're expected to sign in on some sheet. But is a sign-in sheet going to stop a gunman? Hell no. I think something should be done to keep just anybody from being able to walk in to a school.

On a side note, I cannot believe this hasn't been mentioned.

Children stabbed in attack at Chinese school - Asia-Pacific - Al Jazeera English

Exactly what I was thinking. I'm seeing so much about prayer, I just don't get it. At all. He's all knowing and all powerful, yet he can't prevent tragedies like this? But yeah, he's looking out for the survivors. I mean, they might die, but that's part of his plan. It's all part of his plan.

That's pretty crazy. It's good to hear that no one died though.

Pretty strange coincidence.

Banning guns in America will never EVER be the solution. Due to the fact there is no full proof solution here. You will never be able to extinguish all firearms their easier to get than cigarettes on the black market and just as abundant. If you stopped production today Arabs will dance a jig along with countless other 3rd world countries about how much money they're about to make on the black market. Hell not even that far Mexico would be the first to profit. They already control the drug trade so they could just add to the illegal hierarchy that much more. You would only be pouring salt on the wound and crippling the honest people of this country. Criminals aren't deterred from breaking the law with a gun just cause guns are illegal. Most the people in the black market are felons already and not even allowed to own one. Give me a ****ing break

That's a good point. Not locking schools down, but the other part. I think school security should and can be increased from the outside without staining the children's experience there. There's got to be a way to keep gunman from entering schools without making the kids feel like they're in a prison.

I think school security is the more important issue. I was in public schooling not long ago and I'll tell you anybody could have easily walked in that school and started shooting. Something needs to be done about that.

I understand all of that and even agreed with Duga on the fact. My point was that the people who would be handing over guns voluntarily would be people such as myself not criminals who are the basis for the argument originally. That is where the problem lays, you have to take away more civilian rights in order to attain this goal which then leads to more asinine takings of civil liberties.

I'm obviously against the taking of innocent life but I will never surrender to the fact that I should not have the right to bear arms. And drink up Tore its gonna be a long weekend, why search for URL'S that i'll never agree with anyway. :)

I guess. Unfortunately there are tons of violent things happening around the world on any given day, you could find something coincidental about most of them.

Definitely. I'm just saying its weird. Not something that happens every day.

I think we should work to tighten up on gun control before jumping the gun (no pun intended) and doing an all out ban.

I think this seems rather close minded. There are plenty of countries with stricter gun laws and less violence which still has fair civil liberties. It's perfectly possible. Why not learn from that?

One could argue that some sort of principle that you should maximize your amount of civil liberties is anti-societal. After all, society is about giving up freedoms that you'd otherwise have for the benefit of everyone. You give up the right to kill and rob others because that makes it better for everyone, you included (unless you're a robber/killer). Similarly, you should be prepared to give up your right to own guns if that makes it better for everyone. That should be the principle; increased life quality for the people who live in society. Not maximum freedom.

Another thing that's disturbing about this society is some superficial bone headed dude or girl can post a comment on their fb or a pic and say the dumbest line of garbage, and it gets 50 ****ing likes within minutes. People post about something of concern or a real issue like this and it goes almost unnoticed.

I guess you would have to look at it from my perspective then. I look at it from the perspective its a hobby and something I collect. I don't look at it as giving me the ability to rob and kill people. I will agree with you that it would be possible as evidenced by other countries, but it would cost me one of main passions in life, so I guess close minded may be a decent analyzation in a sense.

I will point out one thing, you are clearly only looking at it from the gun law side of things. How is it better for a gun owner and one who follows the rules and does it recreationally to give up his guns? I paid my hard earned money to attain these weapons, took extensive classes on how to not only fire them but break them down. Where does this money come from to replace these said weapons the Govt? Obviously with the National debt skyrocketing that would create another problem and obviously involve some type of tax on the people which includes me. Would i be paying taxes to take my own guns away from myself to better the people?

Guns wont be outlawed and if they ever try build you a storm cellar and hide. Because all hell would break loose. Period.

I would imagine if stricter gun laws were enacted they wouldn't apply to the guns people already own but would rather be in effect for new purchases.

I agree with this also. I think people have focused the discussion on taking guns from existing owners though which I don't agree with. If I'm wrong then please disregard everything i've said.

Aren't you from Norway, tore? This info could be a couple years old but I read that Norway has one of the highest rates of gun ownership in Western Europe, yet possesses the lowest murder rate. And Holland has one of the highest murder rates, despite have one of the lowest gun ownership rates.