Trollheart

Have you watched the programme? You should: it's very enlightening. We're talking about Ford being involved here.
In what way? If you're a truck driver or a taxi cab driver and have been one for most of your life, and there are no other driving jobs available, how do you adapt? Most will be too old to start out afresh; driving for a living will be all they know.

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Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

Frownland

I will, even though as a rule of thumb I ignore people's documentary recs since the docus that people enjoy are the ones that pander to them.

By getting a new job. It sucks, but it's reality. Reminds me of this topic though, which is pretty interesting: https://hackernoon.com/is-ai-driving...m-307c98c87fff

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Trollheart

Well I wouldn't say this panders to me, as I have no strong feelings either way about automated driving, as I pointed out in my previous posts. However, Horizon is a long-established and respected BBC show and uses input from some of the most respected minds or experts in whatever field they're discussing. I am surprised though that they hardly even touched on the idea of massive job and livelihood losses, when it's such a huge issue. That kind of disappointed me. I would have liked to have seen better and less biased argument with both sides being allowed to have their say. There is some hint of trepidation in a few of the points, but largely it's spun as being both positive and unavoidable.
Again though, that's very flippant and careless. How does a man who has driven a truck for forty years start again? Or a woman who has driven a bus or taxicab? It's very easy to say "just get a new job", but we both know the reality of trying to start again at that age. It just does not happen.

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Frownland

You get a new job, you put your nose to the grindstone. If you can't survive that way you can use the other safety nets that we already have in place for people in that situation. I never said it was easy, but if society bends that way (which I do not think will happen in the near future) there really isn't anything else to do but adapt. Do you have an alternative or are you just going to get pissy at the bluntness of my opinion?

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Trollheart

No, I'm saying (which you seem to be wilfully ignoring) that the first six words of your reply are not that easy. Maybe for you: you're young. If the worst were to happen and I had to get a new job, I'd find it very hard at my age. People don't hire over-fifties unless you're in the high-paying corporate world and have a track record, which I don't. So to say "get a new job" makes it seem terribly easy, but it isn't.

Of course I don't have any solutions. This is why I'm making the point. It's not a case of who can come up with the best idea; I'm saying massive job losses will result from vehicle automation. You're saying so what, let them get another job, which is, on any level, flippant, no matter what you say or how you frame it. You're not providing any answers either. You are, however, trivialising the impact this is going to have on millions of families.

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Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

Frownland

You're the only one here who's saying anything about it being easy. I never said anything of the sort and am aware of how difficult that can be.

My solution: let the industry continue on its current trajectory despite workers in that industry being displaced by the change. It's not as if this will be an overnight transition that will take everyone by surprise. Those who are displaced will need to adapt, that's just the reality of the situation TH. Those who cannot cope with that can rely on the welfare systems that we already have in place to help the unemployed.

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Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.

Trollheart

Not really: your quote "get a new job" implies that doing that is easy.
Again, I'm not proposing or looking for a solution. I know it will be hard for those who make their living by driving. I'm just pointing out that it's not as rosy as the docu made it out to be, and that people are going to get hurt. That's progress of course, but I just wish they had addressed it properly in the programme, which they did not.

To give my own personal view, it would be super cool to call a car, get in and basically be driven where I want to go without needing any sort of interaction from me. It will also obviously (or hopefully anyway) cut down on or cut out entirely the many thousands of deaths that result from traffic accidents, and the many more life-changing injuries. I'm just trying to represent a balanced view, and say that while it is exciting and interesting, there will be those who will get burned by it. Of course, that's the same with any major change, but for instance sailboat captains in the nineteenth century could adapt to steamships, and those who flew propellor aircraft could learn to fly a jet. But this cuts out all human intervention, leaving those who drive for a living with nowhere to go.

There is no solution I can see. Hopefully some will be able to make a seismic shift and get into another business, but one major effect of this technology will be surely to lengthen the dole queues. Let's not forget petrol stations either: all these cars will be electric, so no longer any need for your roadside gas station and all its accoutrements and staff.

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Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018