Music Banter - Islam in Europe

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Quote:

Originally Posted by OccultHawk (Post 1826480)

Yeah, if you take it to the extreme to justify warfare it's very problematic. But if you say I live in Culture A so it's more important to me than Culture B but I recognize their right to peacefully exist and if we interact it has to be mutually respectful and beneficial, like trade should be, isn't that enough? If one culture chooses to integrate that's fine but it shouldn't be forced on another culture. No one should be expected to sacrifice their own identity at expense of another's. To some people that might sound fine but then when I extend it and say I can understand why some French people feel culturally threatened I meet resistance. I also don't want to live near any sizable Muslim minority. I like smoking weed, women in bikinis, porn, open gay love, all kinds of music and I do not believe my values and how I want to live are compatible with Islam. That's how I feel. I don't care if that makes me a bigot or whatever.

I can sympathize with this, but I don't think cultures can remain separate and respect one another. They just become "the other" and are viewed as inferior and a potential threat that is stereotyped due to a lack of understanding and familiarity. The preservation of culture is great in theory, but in practice breeds bigotry. I'd rather culture become diluted and people grow closer.

Your example of Japan is prime. Japan has a very interesting and valuable culture, but their isolation has also bred well-documented xenophobia. Obviously all Japanese aren't bigots, but there's definitely a dickish aspect to Japanese culture concerning other cultures.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826494)

Multi-culturalists call for an embrace of heritage for diversity ie African Americans to retain their African culture in addition to their American one

Hence "multi" as opposed to 1 culture

Used in a national sense the US is multicultural because it has a large array of cultures within it not one

What part of African American culture is still African? I'm sure there are still ghosts of African culture, but they've become so Americanized that their culture is simply African American. This is kind of the point. When minority cultures are exposed to different, majority cultures in close proximity, there's a dilution of culture that eventually subsumes the original culture to the point that it ceases to be relevant except as a memory.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826500)

African Americans have developed a unique culture of their own desperate from whites

Which I mentioned. But their African cultures are gone, obviously due to extreme circumstances that don't apply to many other minorities the world over, but the same holds true for many long-term minorities in America to different extents. Cultures evolve, but when exposed to majority cultures in non-native countries the original culture is still altered to the point where it more or less dies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826486)

Then you don't understand what that word means

But this really sounds like you're trying to talk back your bigotry against Muslims

I'm a bigot against Muslims. OK? Is that clear enough?

I not only know what multicultural means but I also understand it's application. I don't think my ideas should be stamped on the entire planet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826505)

I remember I celebrated both Hannuka and Christmas as a child because my family is multicultural

Just another example

Cause I'm sure the Israelites of the Old Testament have had an unchanged culture throughout the last few thousand years. Unless you consider simply the continued observance of holidays to be the benchmark of multiculturalism. There are very few groups besides the Jews that illustrate just how much being influenced by majority cultures can irrevocably and intensely alter culture. I mean, they come from the Middle East, and yet all the Jews I've known might as well be Anglo-Saxon Protestants.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826511)

Its def a bad idea to have cultures remain homogenous and static

I'm rejecting the notion that multiculturalism is about eradicating minority cultures quite the opposite

It's a bad idea for arrogant westerners to tell the rest of the world what they should do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826511)

Its def a bad idea to have cultures remain homogenous and static

I'm rejecting the notion that multiculturalism is about eradicating minority cultures quite the opposite

I've already said I don't support the alternative to multiculturalism, but multiculturalism still has the effect of diluting minority culture. It's simply a reality that you have to accept.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826515)

No more so than it has "diluted" dominant white European American culture

It's made people...

Multicultural

Because they're the majority culture. Am I talking to a wall or something?

There's also uniformity among multicultural societies. The world is more multicultural without universal multiculturalism. As hard headed and bigoted as I am, I'm still flabbergasted at how nonchalantly people announce their values as suitable for the rest of the world. Liberals, conservatives, Christians, Muslims all do that ****. People who like to drop acid say everyone should drop acid. People who care for disabled children say everyone should see what it's like. People who want to live in a multicultural society think everyone should be forced to. People who work hard think everyone should work hard. Like I said way back at the beginning if China doesn't want a Muslim voice in their country so be it. If they don't want me I won't visit. Whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor (Post 1826515)

No more so than it has "diluted" dominant white European American culture

It's made people...

Multicultural

Maybe the Burmese like being Burmese.