Selling Out
 

At any given moment, whenever a band starts to sell more records, switch to a bigger label, play bigger venues, or embrace a poppier sound, there is always whisperings (although, in some cases shouting) of "selling out", a term thrown around far too often if you ask me.

Unless a band actually changes their musical aesthetic in order to become more popular, aka, make more money, it is not "selling out" This means..

Selling T-Shirts at hot topic
Selling music to commercials
Changing style
Being played on MTV/radio

Is not selling out unless the music has been deliberately changed in order to sell more albums. This is impossible to prove since the only people in the world who know whether or not a band truly sold out is the bands themselves, who will never admit it. Hypothetically they could have changed their style to mirror the mainstream because they wanted to move in that direction anyway.

This is why its pretty much impossible to prove a band technically "sold out", and also relatively difficult to argue that a band has, especially since theres always resistance, since the inherent goal of selling out is to gain more fans, fans which will defend the bands new direction.

Kevin Barnes wrote an interesting article on it a while back, in it he mentioned:

"The pseudo-nihilistic punk rockers of the 70's created an impossible code in which no one can actually live by. It's such garbage. The idea that anyone who attempts to do anything commercial is a sell out is completely out of touch with reality. The punk rock manifesto is one of anarchy and intolerance. The punk rockers polluted our minds. They offered a solution that had no future. Of course, if the world would have ended before Sandinista! was released then everything would have been alright. It didn't. Now we have all of these half-conceived ideas and idiot philosophies floating around to confuse and alienate us. I think it is important to face reality. It is important to decide whether you are going to completely rail against the system or find a way to make it work for you. You cannot do both -- and if you attempt to do both you will only become even more bitter and confused"



Later in the essay he defends selling his music to Outback Steakhouse. But my question for musicbanter is: Who can we say with relative certaintity has "sold out" in the true sense of the term?

I went to see Bruce Springsteen...it was sold out. :D

chris cornell

My Chemical Romance. Only the drummer hasn't sold himself to any half baked magazine who want to put the band on the cover to sell more magazines.

Fallout Boy. Their older stuff, I wasn't too fond on, but what the **** at this hippidy hop ****!?

Every Pop Singer. Self explained.

Courtney Love. She wouldn't be Courtney Love if she didn't sell out at any given opportunity. Honestly, putting out your album a week after your husband's death!? What the hell. The world's eyes are on her so she decides to put her band's album out then! And then she goes off with that terogladite from Smashing Pumpkins.

We've only had him do a solo album and song for James Bond since he was in Soundgarden... he was way better with Soundgarden lolz.

Every single Pop singer? Not even close.

A lot of them. They're basically corporate puppets.

I think you're over-estimating how much control she would've had over the release date of the album.

no. cornell is set to release his 3rd solo album soon.

i don't bother with the james bond tune, it's not expected to be great it's expected to fit the movie. anyone would be a fool to turn that down.

audioslave was garbage.

Anti-Flag, the true meaning of selling out.

Signed to a major, became a political version of Good Charlotte, and in doing so completely gave their original anti corporate message the finger. And I don't buy this "we were trying to reach a larger audience" BS.

Whatever, I don't like them at all, not matter what era.

Heres where I dont agree:

Pop singers dont "sell out" since they never set out not to make money in the first place. If a singer has a certain style, and then canges it just to make more money, its selling out...but if thats their original goal (which it always is) its just "selling"

As far as I know, Courtney Loves album was coming out that week anyway, usually release dates are set up months in advance. You could argue however that she sold out due to the stylistic change from her first album, but then, it could be her going off in an independent new direction.

Chris Cornell's solo stuff sold out or Soundgarden?

but thats okay because its not like he was ever any good :p:

:beer:

That first solo album he did made Soundgarden sound like the Beatles in comparison. "Sunshowers" might be the most boring song ever written.

what most of the ****s who bash bands for being sell outs may not know is that selling stuff at hot topic is just another way to get their music out there

Why the term 'selling out' fucks me off:

It's a stupid fake term. The phrase implies that the artist in question should ALWAYS stick to a set plan throughout their career. If an artist wants to change in a certain way in order to sell records (which has been happening FOREVER so i don't know why it pisses everyone off so much) then so be it, it's often resulted in some brilliant music. Imagine if Bowie didn't change to accomodate himself to each passing style? We'd be without some great albums.

I think the thing that annoys me the most about it all is that it is a term that is only ever used by obnoxious little ****heads (no offense). If you are THAT worried about how much an artist is selling and where their T-shirts are sold then you have very strange ideas about what it means to be a music fan.

There is no such thing as a pure punk mentality to making music and distributing it, whatever bands you listen to i can guarantee there will be some element of corporate bull in there. Just don't let it bother you and if you feel the need to say some music is crap then just judge the music itself.

Well Courtney always seemed a bit happy for band interviews and sappy for personal ones, and she granted interviews IMMEDIATLEY afterwards.

And neither Chris nor Soundgarden sold out.

bright eyes and the smiths both sell shirts at hot topic.

I agree completely, although with Bowie you could argue that rather than attempting commercial success he was legitimately changing just to change. Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes.

I feel like theres a difference between embracing a more poppy sound/genre hopping and clearly attempting to gain fans at the expense of musical quality. It shouldnt bother me, because I can just choose not to listen to those albums, but its still sad to see a band decline no matter what reason.

Id like to also add that I dont feel like any band I listen to ever "sold out", so that last sentence is purely hypothetical.

If you read the post I was stating things that I feel are not selling out.


And as a side note, I fucking despise Bright Eyes.

I love it when people who download stuff illegally say that bands make more from merchandising than they do from record sales and then bitch when they have t shirts in hot topic :laughing:

o rly?


on a side note, you've just lost all credibility.

I purchase all of my records legally... usually from Spiller's Records in Cardiff... oldest record shop in Britain :D

lol

Wow. You fail Anticipation.

have you actually heard the new album single? the one produced by timbaland?

YouTube - Chris Cornell - Long Gone (W/OUT "RYAN SEACREST" BIT) (FULL)

that is one thing and one thing only. a mad cash grab attempt. it's not like anyone else in soundgarden has had to whore themselves out to the radio like that for a buck.

'euphoria morning' might be boring to listen to compared to 'badmotorfinger' but at least it came off as a legitimate attempt on cornell's behalf to stretch himself artistically and try his hand at being a proper singer / songwriter. but that above link has NOTHING to do with musical progression and everything to do with money. maybe he's got crazy debts or something, who knows.

either way, you can sit there and deny the fact that cornell has jumped the shark in a big way all you want in an attempt to maintain the idea that grunge pioneers are somehow infallible but it's not going to change the fact that the tune i linked up there WILL be on an album with his name in the not too distant future.

if anything i'd say courtney love has stuck to her roots more than chris cornell.

I know, as if selling T-Shirts in a different location somehow detracts from their musical credibility.

Who's Timbaland?

google doesn't hurt.

Timbaland - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

basically, he's the biggest producer in modern pop music.

So that's why your views are antiquated then :D

My views on contemporary events are antiqued? Such as my views on youtube music 'videos' etc... Yeah, real old. ;) At least half my life isn't over.

It's all about what you've done with it, rather than what you're not going to do with it. ;)

Antiquated-not 'antiqued', which is not a word that I know of. The smiley at the end of my sentence suggests a SOH. Learn to go with the flow fella.

I'm going to live till I'm at least one hundred so a third sounds better.

I don't really care if someone "sells out" or not; if the music is still great, that's all that matters to me.

Of course, "selling out" can drastically decrease the quality of music, but the two aren't necessarily correlated.

Well I know in the immediate future I'll be finishing 6th form, going to university to continue my law and welsh (language) studies. Easy degree the second one, it's my first language.

selling albums and making money while doing something you love is what its all about

even if an artist could be said to have 'sold out'

thats what they were doing in the first place
trying to find someone to sell out 2

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Getting played on the radio isnt selling out. I've heard the Melvins and Primus being played on our national radio station

I feel like some people are misinterpreting me. Let me reiterate:

At any given moment, whenever a band starts to sell more records, switch to a bigger label, play bigger venues, or embrace a poppier sound, there is always whisperings (although, in some cases shouting) of "selling out", a term thrown around far too often if you ask me.

Unless a band actually changes their musical aesthetic in order to become more popular, aka, make more money, it is not "selling out" This means..

Selling T-Shirts at hot topic
Selling music to commercials
Changing style
Being played on MTV/radio

Is not selling out unless the music has been deliberately changed in order to sell more albums.

I'd love to be able to sell out.

This mansion won't pay for itself.

Who gives a fuck what some bunch of kids who've never had a full time job or had to support themselves think.

This is probably the approach i'd take too.
People can laugh and laugh at Mick Hucknall or some twat but at the end of the day while you think you're on your highhorse he's has literal stables and sleeps on piles of money.

To re-iterate my previous point: Who fudging cares?