Defining and Organizing What We Call Music

[Mr November]

I wanted to ask you all what you thought about a few things. A bunch of questions that really fall under the dilemma of how we think about music in a broader sense, and how that effects the industry, society, and our own ability to experience new forms of music.

I) So my first question is what is music? Does it have to be produced by a human? Would you consider a birds song music? Whale music? Wind chimes? The Ocean? Is music simply sound? Or does it have to be an art form, with a message or a concept?

II) Music can cover a lot of different sounds, it can exist in many different lengths, volumes, tones, etc.

Personally I don't like genres for music, and I tend to compare artists to other well known bench marks rather than label them. But we all use genre's and labels to try and identify music in the endless ocean of other bands, songs, and sounds...

What do these genres mean? Like what does rock really mean? What does indie mean? What does pop mean? Are they actually saying anything or is it just something left over from those many decades when music started to branch off into one million different kinds of imitation, experimentation, and combination? I mean, classical music has genres based on certain times in history that can tell you a lot about what a given piece will sound like - this is because composers would always write by a certain set of rules, and you sort of new what to expect.

So what do genres mean? How do we use them? How should we use them/should we at all? And what's the future of this whole concept. Are we just going to get where the point where there will be so many different sounds and concepts that there would be too many genres to remember (and I'm all for that).

III) Last question: Why do we like music? Is it just the patterns? What makes some music better to us than other music, and is music better the more complex it is, or is that complexity deeper than the sounds being produced and more about the emotions that are created by it. Is difficult music better... etc, etc. ???

So that's it. Take a shot at these questions if you want.

[CanwllCorfe]

I) To me, music is the arrangement of sounds in such a way that creates a pleasant* experience for the listener. I would say that music has to have some kind of intention behind it. All those sounds you mentioned are beautiful, but I think of them as noises. Pleasant noises.

II) I think of genres as just another way to classify music. We classify damn near everything, so why not music?

III) I would say that on the basest level, we like the music we like because we find it pleasant* to the senses (in this case, hearing). I, for one, don't find overly technical music to be enjoyable at all. I think of the songs I have as little images, places, feelings, or a mix. I like to bring them up every now and then, depending on my mood and whatnot.

*Pleasant, as in enjoyable. This is very subjective of course.

[ThePhanastasio]

Originally Posted by Ian E Coleman

I) So my first question is what is music? Does it have to be produced by a human? Would you consider a birds song music? Whale music? Wind chimes? The Ocean? Is music simply sound? Or does it have to be an art form, with a message or a concept?

I always think of music in the simplest terms as being a combination of sounds designed to elicit an emotional response. Even that, though, doesn't fully sum it up. Sounds are definitely an important quality in music, but just as effective is the proper use of silence. The silence evokes a mood as well, and it is deliberate - being that way by design can make it fall into the category of music in my mind, although not necessarily music that I enjoy; the enjoyment and emotional response for any given person is completely subjective. Also, there is beauty in the sounds of nature, and of sounds which aren't designed to be musical in nature. I think that those aren't music by their own design, but by how the listener subjectively interprets those sounds. One person could just hear birds and think, "Oh, birds. Whatever," whereas a completely different person can have a very strong response to the "bird-song" and interpret the sounds as something more. I suppose in that way, it is music.

Really, I suppose what I'm saying is music is what you make it - if you hear a train and it elicits a response from you, and you personally pick out the complexities within any given sound and are affected, that's music to you.

Originally Posted by Ian E Coleman

II)
So what do genres mean? How do we use them? How should we use them/should we at all? And what's the future of this whole concept. Are we just going to get where the point where there will be so many different sounds and concepts that there would be too many genres to remember (and I'm all for that).

Genres are just classification. I feel that things are lumped into genres when they're something that appeals to a large group of people who like other artists within a given group. There's not necessarily a necessity for it, as classification isn't really ever a necessity, just a human urge for order, but it's not a bad thing. And if there are too many genres to remember in the future, so be it. The classification system itself doesn't necessarily have to be important, although some people do think it is in some way, shape, or form.

Originally Posted by Ian E Coleman

III) Last question: Why do we like music? Is it just the patterns? What makes some music better to us than other music, and is music better the more complex it is, or is that complexity deeper than the sounds being produced and more about the emotions that are created by it. Is difficult music better... etc, etc. ???

I would imagine this is different for everyone. I have a friend with whom I was talking about music recently, and he likes the lyrics and effective vocal delivery in the majority of music he listens to. I personally like a little bit about everything that's appealed to me over time, but I'll definitely have to say this all varies greatly from person to person.

[Nosferatu Man]

Fantastic idea for a thread Mr Coleman. It is a subject that interests me greatly.

For me music is more than those sounds you described it is made by someone with an artistic vision who is using sound to express their feelings. It is a simple and beautiful expression of emotion when it is created properly. Look to Wish You Were here every moment of that song carries meaning and is significant. So for me Rebecca Black and Justin Bieber do not create music. I think all that Simon cowell inspired, tee total pseudo musicians a la Jessie J teenage age pop bollocks is just noise. That might even be insulting to noise.

We classify and compartmentalize our music into genres so we can express the types of music we like. It is actually hard to explain exactly what type of music you like without naming genres. Without naming bands or genres it is almost impossible to describe what you like to another musically informed person and have them play something that matches your description.

Why do I like music?

I like music because I can get to know it, it has layers, hidden meanings, emotions all these things. I can go on journey through it.

Bob Dylan's I want you, 'I wait for them to interrupt, me drinking from my broken cup'. He is talking of the saviours who are waiting for him. Why does he wait for them? He is drinking from a broken cup, he must want salvation.

I could go on for ages and ages, it's just I am almost late for work!!!

[GERD]

Originally Posted by Ian E Coleman

I wanted to ask you all what you thought about a few things. A bunch of questions that really fall under the dilemma of how we think about music in a broader sense, and how that effects the industry, society, and our own ability to experience new forms of music.

I) So my first question is what is music? Does it have to be produced by a human? Would you consider a birds song music? Whale music? Wind chimes? The Ocean? Is music simply sound? Or does it have to be an art form, with a message or a concept?

II) Music can cover a lot of different sounds, it can exist in many different lengths, volumes, tones, etc.

Personally I don't like genres for music, and I tend to compare artists to other well known bench marks rather than label them. But we all use genre's and labels to try and identify music in the endless ocean of other bands, songs, and sounds...

What do these genres mean? Like what does rock really mean? What does indie mean? What does pop mean? Are they actually saying anything or is it just something left over from those many decades when music started to branch off into one million different kinds of imitation, experimentation, and combination? I mean, classical music has genres based on certain times in history that can tell you a lot about what a given piece will sound like - this is because composers would always write by a certain set of rules, and you sort of new what to expect.

So what do genres mean? How do we use them? How should we use them/should we at all? And what's the future of this whole concept. Are we just going to get where the point where there will be so many different sounds and concepts that there would be too many genres to remember (and I'm all for that).

III) Last question: Why do we like music? Is it just the patterns? What makes some music better to us than other music, and is music better the more complex it is, or is that complexity deeper than the sounds being produced and more about the emotions that are created by it. Is difficult music better... etc, etc. ???

So that's it. Take a shot at these questions if you want.

that's a great question.i dont know why i like music, i think it's just natural isn't it? i think music is whatever sounds you like.if you pick up a drum and bang it, it's a form of music(to me anyway).
i listen to stuff that incorporates a lot of natural sounds and grim aural landscapes.if you like it and consider it to be music, then music is what it is whatever others may think.

[Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra]

Music is noises you like. That's the thick, and thin of it in my eyes.