Has music become stagnant (stopped moving/evolving)?

Pursuingchange · 12-08-2012, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

What did you mean?

Lol

**Janszoon** · 12-08-2012, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pursuingchange

Lol

It was a serious question. I'm still unclear what you mean.

Pursuingchange · 12-08-2012, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

It was a serious question. I'm still unclear what you mean.

Ok ok. I'll restate my initial question. What I meant to ask was, has music stopped making large innovations? Has music hit a wall creatively? Do you think music, in its current form has reached the end of its creative possibilities? Have you seen large innovations that took the world by storm since Kurt Cobain popularized alternative, or since EVH popularized that style of guitar playing? I think its a valid question and I'm looking for REAL, INFORMED, NO-NONSENSE answers.

**Janszoon** · 12-08-2012, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pursuingchange

Ok ok. I'll restate my initial question. What I meant to ask was, has music stopped making large innovations? Has music hit a wall creatively? Do you think music, in its current form has reached the end of its creative possibilities?

No, no, and no. Though, historically I don't know how many innovations I'd describe as "large", I certainly don't see a decrease in innovation overall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pursuingchange

Have you seen large innovations that took the world by storm since Kurt Cobain popularized alternative, or since EVH popularized that style of guitar playing?

Not sure how to answer this since I don't agree with the assumptions you're making. Kurt Cobain didn't single-handedly popularize alternative, and even if he had, I don't see how simply popularizing something that already exists is particularly innovative. As far as Eddie Van Halen goes: He was certainly influential, but is his guitar style really a "large innovation"? I'd say not really.

Pursuingchange · 12-09-2012, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

No, no, and no. Though, historically I don't know how many innovations I'd describe as "large", I certainly don't see a decrease in innovation overall.

Not sure how to answer this since I don't agree with the assumptions you're making. Kurt Cobain didn't single-handedly popularize alternative, and even if he had, I don't see how simply popularizing something that already exists is particularly innovative. As far as Eddie Van Halen goes: He was certainly influential, but is his guitar style really a "large innovation"? I'd say not really.

You and I are talking on two totally different levels. You are seeming to break everything down to its most basic (trivial) components and are not seeing it the way I'm seeing it. Sure, technically Eddies Van Halen's guitar thing was nothing 'new' in every sense of the word. Just as Michael Jackson's dancing was technically nothing new, I think everyone here knows that. But it was the style, the sound, the way they did it. They owned it. It sparked new energy on many different levels. EVH's guitar style pretty much set the entire stage of what rock became after that. There are only a few of those people throughout history who have "it" factor to cause true innovation.

Please don't pick apart what I just said man and try to come up with some cunning and witty rebuttal to it just for the sake of sounding smart like everyone else who uses the internet nowadays does. They'll sit there at their computer and think to themselves "what's a good way to word this that will make me seem so intelligent?" because trust me, that's how you've come off to me so far. I think you know full well what I'm saying here about the music thing anyway.

**Janszoon** · 12-09-2012, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pursuingchange

You and I are talking on two totally different levels. You are seeming to break everything down to its most basic (trivial) components and are not seeing it the way I'm seeing it. Sure, technically Eddies Van Halen's guitar thing was nothing 'new' in every sense of the word. Just as Michael Jackson's dancing was technically nothing new, I think everyone here knows that. But it was the style, the sound, the way they did it. They owned it. It sparked new energy on many different levels. EVH's guitar style pretty much set the entire stage of what rock became after that. There are only a few of those people throughout history who have "it" factor to cause true innovation.

Please don't pick apart what I just said man and try to come up with some cunning and witty rebuttal to it just for the sake of sounding smart like everyone else who uses the internet nowadays does. They'll sit there at their computer and think to themselves "what's a good way to word this that will make me seem so intelligent?" because trust me, that's how you've come off to me so far. I think you know full well what I'm saying here about the music thing anyway.

Yeah, you're bitching that things aren't as good as they used to be and expecting people to just agree with you. Problem is you aren't making the case very well and apparently get upset when someone responds to the examples you're trying to use.

Pursuingchange · 12-09-2012, 01:50 PM

Look man, don't be contrary. The reason I asked you not to think of some witty rebuttal is because thats all people use the internet for these days. People will turn something that is not an argument into one so they can refute and make themselves sound smart. That's exactly what you are doing. Like I said, I think you know I'm talking about.

EVH and Kurt Cobain are not the only innovators. They are just two of the few I listed. I never had any malice when I created this thread, but somehow I knew that There would be a couple of people on here who find an argument here and try to pick it alart untill the relevance is gone, and then be all smartass about it. What I'm trying to say is very simple. It doesn't take a lot of thinking to understand. I don't think there are as many innovators in this time. It might be because music in general is hard to innovate in this time, or lack of new musical avenues and ideas to explore. I cited the people who I believed were true innovators in history. There are more than what I listed, but those few are ones that really stand out to me. Plus, how can you say that I'm only focusing on rock guitar when I clearly stated Michael Jackson and dancing? Quit picking apart what I'm saying and be a part of the real conversation man. There's no arguments going on here.

Neapolitan · 12-08-2012, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pursuingchange

Ok ok. I'll restate my initial question. What I meant to ask was, has music stopped making large innovations? Has music hit a wall creatively? Do you think music, in its current form has reached the end of its creative possibilities? Have you seen large innovations that took the world by storm since Kurt Cobain popularized alternative, or since EVH popularized that style of guitar playing? I think its a valid question and I'm looking for REAL, INFORMED, NO-NONSENSE answers.

The idea of what is an important "Innovation" is generally only relevant to a certain demographic during a certain time period.

Take the approach of Rock docs for instance, a lot of them just showcases one particulat person, band or event, but it doesn't tell the whole story. There is a certain timeline and outline that is accepted and anything that falls outside of that isn't mentioned. Saying somthing like only one guitar player e.g. Kurt Cobain or Eddie Van Halen started it all and done it all is "causal reductionism." They have their place in music history, I don't think their contributions should be overblown but then again I don't think they should be underestimated either.

12-09-2012, 01:50 PM	#7 (permalink)
Pursuingchange Music Addict Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 139	Look man, don't be contrary. The reason I asked you not to think of some witty rebuttal is because thats all people use the internet for these days. People will turn something that is not an argument into one so they can refute and make themselves sound smart. That's exactly what you are doing. Like I said, I think you know I'm talking about. EVH and Kurt Cobain are not the only innovators. They are just two of the few I listed. I never had any malice when I created this thread, but somehow I knew that There would be a couple of people on here who find an argument here and try to pick it alart untill the relevance is gone, and then be all smartass about it. What I'm trying to say is very simple. It doesn't take a lot of thinking to understand. I don't think there are as many innovators in this time. It might be because music in general is hard to innovate in this time, or lack of new musical avenues and ideas to explore. I cited the people who I believed were true innovators in history. There are more than what I listed, but those few are ones that really stand out to me. Plus, how can you say that I'm only focusing on rock guitar when I clearly stated Michael Jackson and dancing? Quit picking apart what I'm saying and be a part of the real conversation man. There's no arguments going on here.