Musical Pet Peeves

Dylstew · 04-12-2015, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Except that many of the bands that developed the genre had roots in metal, or became full-fledged metal bands as time went on: Repulsion, Napalm Death, Carcass, Terrifyer, Defecation, Brutal Truth, Bolt Thrower, etc. And modern grind is pretty clearly a metal sub-genre.

One word: Deathgrind. Mixes Death Metal with Grindcore, thus gets more metal.
And like I said, it varies. Many of the modern ones tend to be more metal, many of the older ones more punk.
Napalm Death started Grindcore and went Deathgrind later on.

edit: With crust punk and the regular type of grindcore is that they take these metal elements to make them more extreme punk, if that makes any sense.
some Extreme Metal wouldn't exist without Punk so It makes sense the two meet every now and then.

The Batlord · 04-12-2015, 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylstew

One word: Deathgrind. Mixes Death Metal with Grindcore, thus gets more metal.
And like I said, it varies. Many of the modern ones tend to be more metal, many of the older ones more punk.
Napalm Death started Grindcore and went Deathgrind later on.

And Repulsioon were members of Death before they recorded the first grindcore album of all time. The evolution of grindcore is too intertwined with early death metal to separate grindcore and deathgrind except as descriptors of just how much DM influence one band has over another.

And even on their first album, Napalm Death evolved to take on more death metal elements on the B-side.

Dylstew · 04-12-2015, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

And Repulsioon were members of Death before they recorded the first grindcore album of all time. The evolution of grindcore is too intertwined with early death metal to separate grindcore and deathgrind except as descriptors of just how much DM influence one band has over another.

And even on their first album, Napalm Death evolved to take on more death metal elements on the B-side.

So basically, Crust + early death = grindcore?
You're right, the second half does sound pretty death.

edit: This is starting to give me headaches, but I think I'm coming to the conclusion that Grindcore is both punk and metal, Crust and powerviolence are Punk with some light metal influences, and modern hardcore is still a mystery. So I think I'm partially wrong, partially right.

The Batlord · 04-12-2015, 04:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylstew

So basically, Crust + early death = grindcore?
You're right, the second half does sound pretty death.

edit: This is starting to give me headaches, but I think I'm coming to the conclusion that Grindcore is both punk and metal, Crust and powerviolence are Punk with some light metal influences, and modern hardcore is still a mystery. So I think I'm partially wrong, partially right.

Trying to make it cut-and-dry is pointless. By the nineties, thrash, death metal, and black metal were distinct genres, but throughout the eighties the distinctions between them (not to mention grindcore and even hardcore) could be so vague that classifying them is only useful in hindsight. Sarcofago was somewhere inbetween all three, early Sepultura likewise. Even early Slayer could just as easily be called first-wave black metal. Other bands that are called thrash, such as Sodom and Destruction, have early albums that are considered black metal. Obituary has a heavy Celtic Frost/Hellhamer influence the same as the Norwegian black metal bands. Listen to early Death demos and you can see a straight line going from those same influences until they finally record their debut which is death metal that's still not removed from thrash.

When genres are developing they're just too linked to multiple other genres for classification to be black and white.

**Janszoon** · 04-12-2015, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Trying to make it cut-and-dry is pointless. By the nineties, thrash, death metal, and black metal were distinct genres, but throughout the eighties the distinctions between them (not to mention grindcore and even hardcore) could be so vague that classifying them is only useful in hindsight. Sarcofago was somewhere inbetween all three, early Sepultura likewise. Even early Slayer could just as easily be called first-wave black metal. Other bands that are called thrash, such as Sodom and Destruction, have early albums that are considered black metal. Obituary has a heavy Celtic Frost/Hellhamer influence the same as the Norwegian black metal bands. Listen to early Death demos and you can see a straight line going from those same influences until they finally record their debut which is death metal that's still not removed from thrash.

When genres are developing they're just too linked to multiple other genres for classification to be black and white.

Exactly. That's why I say 80s hardcore was clearly a subgenre of punk but later hardcore is its own thing by and large.