Trite sayings that people think are profound.

**Frownland** · 12-01-2018, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

Looks like you're the one not understanding the pessimism I'm talking about. Stop trying to achieve a gotcha moment and actually read my posts. You're running yourself in circles, ya damn goof.

Do you recognize that the logical conclusions of nihilism can be reached without pessimism? Because you're conflating pessimism with nihilism if your answer is no.

EDIT: Derpville got it backwards

windsock · 12-01-2018, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucem Ferre

We don't feel like you're ****ting on us and a lot of members on here ARE crotchety.

It's cause you continue to think I'm addressing you as glass-half-emptys. Philosophical pessimism is not the same thing as the pessimism you're familiar with. Read my posts, I'm not ****ting on anybody.

Read up on Schopenhauer. Nietzsche's view lines up with him but he's more of a "life-affirming" pessimist while Schopenhauer was the opposite. They're still both pessimists and Nietzsche, as I'm sure your aware, is the one who popularized nihilist theory.

**Frownland** · 12-01-2018, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

It's cause you continue to think I'm addressing you as glass-half-emptys. Philosophical pessimism is not the same thing as the pessimism you're familiar with. Read my posts, I'm not ****ting on anybody.

Try reading our posts. We don't think that you're ****ting on anybody, we think that you do not understand what you are talking about.

Lucem Ferre · 12-01-2018, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

Still a philosophy based in pessimism lmao. Just because you find an optimistic altruist to be subjectively wrong doesn't mean they are. Just cause I'm an atheist doesn't mean the absence of God is a proven fact, it's just I've assembled enough scientific evidence and personal opinion to make the (what I believe to be) reasonable assumption that there is no deity. The same goes for you and your nihilism, which in some ways is even more subjective than religious belief as it lies in the realm of philosophy. You can go on and on all day about how dumb those gall-darned Christians and optimists are but it doesn't change the fact that not only your belief is as subjective as theirs but that you're on the pessimistic end.

I feel like you're getting personally insulted by my use of the term pessimism because you think I'm calling you a cantankerous grouch. I'm not. Again, I'll pull up Wikipedia's definition of philosophical pessimism:

Bold lines up with pessimism and nihilism's linkage, italics lines up with the nihilist spectrum I discussed previously, and impact lines up with you not being a Scrooge for being a nihilist.

The first bolded part you already proved to have no relation to nihilism since you're a nihilist that's fairly optimistic.

The second bolded part goes right back to Frownland's point that just because nihilism attracts pessimists doesn't mean nihilism is pessimistic.

Lucem Ferre · 12-01-2018, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

It's cause you continue to think I'm addressing you as glass-half-emptys. Philosophical pessimism is not the same thing as the pessimism you're familiar with. Read my posts, I'm not ****ting on anybody.

Read up on Schopenhauer. Nietzsche's view lines up with him but he's more of a "life-affirming" pessimist while Schopenhauer was the opposite. They're still both pessimists and Nietzsche, as I'm sure your aware, is the one who popularized nihilist theory.

And Lil Pump kind of built where Nietszche fell short.

windsock · 12-01-2018, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Do you recognize that the logical conclusions of nihilism can be reached without pessimism? Because you're conflating pessimism with nihilism if your answer is no.

I think that pessimism and nihilism have a lot of fundamental crossover. Nihilism, a grand-scale skepticism, pessimism, and ultimate rejection of existence shares a lot in common with philosophical pessimism. The two are not the same and I won't conflate them as such, and they're different especially in the vein of how they affirm life itself. Nietzsche drew a lot of inspiration from Schopenhauer in how he parroted nihilism but he made it clear they aren't the same thing. If they were, nihilism wouldn't exist and we would just have philo pessimism.

windsock · 12-01-2018, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucem Ferre

The first bolded part you already proved to have no relation to nihilism since you're a nihilist that's fairly optimistic.

The second bolded part goes right back to Frownland's point that just because nihilism attracts pessimists doesn't mean nihilism is pessimistic.

First part affirms that pessimism is in opposition to optimism. Not super related to nihilism itself, I mainly pointed it out so you guys would know what I'm talking about.

Second part: have you ever considered why pessimists gravitate towards nihilism? Could it be that they are somehow...linked?

**Frownland** · 12-01-2018, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

I think that pessimism and nihilism have a lot of fundamental crossover. Nihilism, a grand-scale skepticism, pessimism, and ultimate rejection of existence shares a lot in common with philosophical pessimism. The two are not the same and I won't conflate them as such, and they're different especially in the vein of how they affirm life itself. Nietzsche drew a lot of inspiration from Schopenhauer in how he parroted nihilism but he made it clear they aren't the same thing. If they were, nihilism wouldn't exist and we would just have philo pessimism.

Can you answer my question?

Quote:

Do you recognize that the logical conclusions of nihilism can be reached without pessimism?

Lucem Ferre · 12-01-2018, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by windsock

First part affirms that pessimism is in opposition to optimism. Not super related to nihilism itself, I mainly pointed it out so you guys would know what I'm talking about.

Second part: have you ever considered why pessimists gravitate towards nihilism? Could it be that they are somehow...linked?

It's because it's commonly thought that the lack of a higher meaning is negative when that's just a matter of opinion. We already went over this.

At the same time it also says that not all pessimists are nihilists. If you want to truly revel in pessimism you'd believe that we were all created to suffer. Actually, I think Frown already said that.

windsock · 12-01-2018, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Also seems like you don't really understand atheism, either.

LMAO Frown please be my guest and debunk religion right here and now. Totally. With complete, indisputable, verifiable proof that cannot be vetoed by any sort of logic to boot. You'd be saving the human race a great deal of hardship it's gone through since we gained cognizance.

The truth is you can't disprove the existence of a deity because of how slippery of a concept it is.

"Well how do you explain lightning, Christian?"

"Magic."

When the power of god, aka magic comes into play, literally every scientific concept gets thrown out of the window. And you can't disprove it because of how incredibly intangible it is. There's a reason that such a large amount of the Earth's population is religious, because you can't just walk up to them and say "you're wrong because of 1 2 and 3 and there's absolutely no logical reasoning, fanciful or otherwise, that can disprove me" because the concept of religion is inherently disprovable.

The essential argument against religion, putting aside the countless upon countless piles of scientific evidence to say the contract, is occam's razor. The reason people are atheists is because when they're faced with the concept of an uncaring and chaotic universe and a mythological magical sky daddy, they're likely to shave Yaweh off.