agree

This is definitely part of the curriculum in any school system. The effectiveness of how its being taught could be called into question though

agree

interesting, never thought about that really


I don't see how being white has anything to do with how I'm interpreting the data that's out there

That's what's up dude, its the ultimate snack imo

that's a very white thing to say

"Fat" isn't a pejorative, it's a descriptive term that can be used for adults, babies, dogs, and asses alike.

Also the economy argument lol. Dumb statements like that are hurting the howle cunchtry my friend

You're maybe thinking of "phat"

Do you disagree about the correlations drawn from the data regarding the economic impact or do you simply think the impact is irrelevant? This is the only place where I've ever really had this conversation so if I'm being dumb I'd love to be educated on why. MB is cool as a place to hone my arguments with some smart people in a zero-pressure setting

This isn't 1997

Using economic impact (which is more related to our bloated healthcare system than obesity itself) as some kind of justification that fat people apparently deserve a prerogative like obesity is solely a lifestyle choice is pretty dumb, yes.

Definitely true, although there's a ratio there which is hard to determine

I'd be curious to see the fraction of the obese population that has reached that point due to factors outside of their control. Its a sizable percentage for sure but I also don't believe in enabling destructive behavior among the population that can do something about their overall health.

Thinking that personal choice matters is thinking that personal responsibility is a thing which means that pulling oneself up by the bootstraps is a thing which means one is a libertarian which means one is a republican which means one is a nazi.

(c) MB

my mind is irreversibly blown

The majority of people get there simply based on what their family feeds them growing up and continue those habits when they reach adulthood. Our brains adjust to our body weight over time and if you have years of obesity under your belt, the brain references that as the body's set weight point. Surely you've met a thin/fit person who could eat like a horse and not gain a pound? That's because of set weight points as well. Set points makes losing weight as an obese person insanely more difficult than losing a couple of extra pounds gained over the holidays for someone with an average body weight. It even impacts the immune system when the body goes below the set weight which makes obese people more prone to sickness when they're losing weight in the same way that you losing 20+ pounds over two weeks would make you sick.

There are also genetic variables that drastically change on a case by case basis. Then you have the economic component where the American industry has made it more affordable to buy junk food than a healthy meal plan, which contributes to poor Americans being more likely to struggle with weight. Combine that with the lack of widespread culinary and nutritional knowledge and you have more people buying easy premade junk foods exacerbating the issue.

There's just so many variables at play that "just lose the weight!" as a response to the obesity epidemic doesn't even skim the tip of the iceberg. Obesity sucks, to think that someone just chooses it is simply ignorant.

Hey, while we're talking about stats as justification for ideology, have you read The Bell Curve?

I'm not even fat, I'm just unhealthy. And I usually eat more junk than most of my fat friends.

Some great points in here

Makes sense

Also makes sense, though I’d be interested in a source on the immune system point. I’m sure I can find that on my own

Definitely true

Now this I just don’t understand. In some of my earlier posts I highlighted ways that I personally have saved a ton of money by doing smart meal prepping. I average roughly $2 per meal when I’m really putting in the work. Are grocery store prices drastically different across the country? That’s the only explanation I can think of. Chicken and vegetables are pretty cheap and that’s the core of my diet. How much money do people waste on fast food, unnecessary desserts, and soda? I think your following point here about knowledge is valid, but the notion that eating healthy is out of reach unless you have money just does not seem true to me

100% agree

I have not but I should, it sounds fascinating

It's ridiculous BS.

I spend an average of $30 (US) per week on food which I buy at a grocery store. Rice, beans, chicken, pasta, eggs, cheese, fruit, veg, peanut butter, are a just a few of the items I might buy in a typical week. Eating healthy meals is just as affordable and often cheaper than eating junk food.

How do we know what you're making is healthy?

1: Healthy food is cheap if you make it but premade junk food is easy, cheap, and widely available.
2: I didn't say it was the sole factor, I said that it exacerbates the issue when combined with a lack of culinary and nutritional education.

It's also incredibly racist.

Sometimes I read discussions like this and I find that the line between being correct and sh*tty person and incorrect and a good person is blurry as f*ck.

YD is a good person?

I'm both mentally ill and physically unhealthy (not really fat though) so I'm twice the burden on the healthcare system that I never get to use.

I think everybody is both a bad and good person which is my point.

The key takeaway from this discussion is that in light of the socio-economic factors that are escalating the obesity epidemic, we have a moral imperative to call newborn babies fat fucks.

"That is not my experience, therefore it must not be true."

You’re disputing the points about food cost? Do you have a counter argument? I’m just using factual numbers of food costs at the grocery store where it’s possible, with just a little extra effort in terms of preparation and washing dishes, to have nutritious meals daily at an average cost that is significantly less than what people often consider to be the benchmark for cheap food i.e. McDonald’s or Taco Bell or whatever. If I should be thinking about this some other way please actually say so instead of being passive aggressive with these kinds of useless posts

Healthy food being affordable is not a counter argument to unhealthy food being affordable.

Think about it like this. In your typical grocery store, what is the ratio of healthy to unhealthy foods? Which receives more marketing: healthy or unhealthy foods? You could never enter a grocery store and live off of Taco Bell and gas station foods (which you will be more likely to find in a low income area than a grocery store). What's the ratio of healthy to unhealthy foods in those places? If you were never introduced to meal planning growing up, which option sounds more affordable: $5 dinner today ready to go or $10 of more food than you need for tonight that goes bad quickly and involves extra work?

You should try understanding other people pointing out that there's more to life than your personal experience instead of just dismissing them as useless.

It is when one of the topics at hand is the degree to which the undeterminable percentage of the obese population actually has control and choice over the fact that they’re obese or not

In a typical grocery store the very first major section that is right in front of your face when you walk in is the produce section. They throw a giant beautiful collage of colorful health foods at you the very second you walk in the door. So I don’t think the healthy options are necessarily being hidden from people.

In terms of marketing I certainly agree. You see candy bars and soda in marketing way more than anything else.

The fact that there are areas where grocery stores with healthy options are unavailable or harder to find is certainly a good point.

The lack of knowledge and education on how to plan out a diet is definitely a problem, another good point there.

The only context where I’ve brought up any personal experiences is where I talked about how I’ve managed to have a healthy diet for very cheap, which is only using objective numbers from what’s available at the stores where I live. I’m hardly deriving any points from my own life, I’m giving factual numbers. Unless the geographical difference is more severe than I think, but that’s a possibility that I’ve already acknowledged in another post

Only if you ignore every other factor that influences the issue.

1. It's usually flowers which are not very healthy the last time I checked. They do that so to prime people to think that their food is fresh. It's why the meat is usually in the back, too, since it rots fastest.
2. I never suggested that healthy food is hidden.
3. Please answer the question

Cool beans! Talking about how much you pay for food while ignoring the other aspects that influence obesity, which you have never experienced, is definitely defining an issue by your own personal experiences.

Obesity rates don't rise to epidemic levels for no reason, and from where I'm sitting, a number of cultural and social factors have a marked influence on what we're seeing today.

At no point in time have I denied that.

I would certainly argue, however, that there are many out there that have the means and knowledge to make better, healthier decisions for themselves and any reasoning for why they don’t is simply making weak excuses for being lazy and selfish.

If you stopped hunting for justification for this argument, you'd probably understand my points better.

Which is something I’m clearly not doing considering I’ve conceded on multiple occasions that you have made great points. This is a multi-faceted issue where some factors may be more important than others to certain people. There are rich people that are obese, and there are also poor people that are obese. The reasoning in either case could be dramatically different


It is unfair and disingenuous of you to keep saying I’m ignoring other aspects of the discussion, as I already highlighted above.

And at the end of the day I think we could all agree that something needs to change but this is America we’re talking about so who the **** knows I guess

Thats why we all need legal weed baby 420 blaze it

"I recognize that this is a multi-faceted issue, but this one facet doesn't stand up on it's own, therefore fat people deserve pejoratives due to their evil nature."

Fixed

Anyway good discussion, I appreciate it.

They don’t, they should be better for themselves and their loved ones

If you're suggesting that they need to have an excuse for their weight or else they'll be subjected to your weirdly vengeful namecalling, then you're pretty much saying that they do.

Heyo! Take my wife, please!

So embarassing

I feel the exact opposite. It would be incredibly selfish and unfair to my wife if I suddenly let myself go. Part of the agreement to get married at least to me was for us to both put in the effort to keep ourselves healthy so that we can live long, healthy lives and enjoy our time together for as long as possible. Getting fat would be potentially robbing both of us of that opportunity

making elph look rational smdh

So if she got fat you'd divorce her for not being considerate of how attractive you find her?

Only if she CHOOSES to become fat. If its medical or something maybe she can just try carrots

Book does phone thing but better

If it happened because she did a complete 180 in terms of personality, life goals, values etc then yeah there would be some problems in the relationship at that point.