The #metoo thread (sexual assault and/or misconduct discussion)

[Frownland]

How do you define free will?

[OccultHawk]

Originally Posted by Frownland

How do you define free will?

The ability to control anything you do.

[Frownland]

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

The ability to control anything you do.

I define it as not being bound to a predetermined fate.

Do you consider "you" to be separate from the brain?

[OccultHawk]

Originally Posted by Frownland

I define it as not being bound to a predetermined fate.

Do you consider "you" to be separate from the brain?

To simplify the conversation and to avoid having to go into every useless caveat I'll just say no.

Since we have no control over even the tiniest of our actions we are obviously bound to a predetermined fate. It was settled and soon as the Big Bang started the universe expanding. Obviously. Unless you think we are of some supernatural property from outside the universe.

[Frownland]

Originally Posted by 66Sexy

To hold a series of algorithms responsible for anything is nonsense but there's no current alternative.

What would you do if your computer caught on fire?

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

To simplify the conversation and to avoid having to go into every useless caveat I'll just say no.

Since we have no control over even the tiniest of our actions we are obviously bound to a predetermined fate. It was settled and soon as the Big Bang started the universe expanding. Obviously. Unless you think we are of some supernatural property from outside the universe.

If "we" are our brains, then "we" are the ones controlling our actions. Also, predetermined is not synonymous with predictable.

[WWWP]

Hard determinism I can get behind, "no free will" in terms of no accountability is nonsense.

[OccultHawk]

Originally Posted by wolverinewolfweiselpigeon

Hard determinism I can get behind, "no free will" in terms of no accountability is nonsense.

We’re evolved to see a lack of free will as counterintuitive so it’s an existential dead end to live as if there’s no free will even though there isn’t. We must ignore the truth and live as if we have free will. And that means holding people accountable for their behavior. We’re a long way off from transitioning into how to deal with matters such as accountability.

[The Batlord]

Originally Posted by OccultHawk

We’re evolved to see a lack of free will as counterintuitive so it’s an existential dead end to live as if there’s no free will even though there isn’t. We must ignore the truth and live as if we have free will. And that means holding people accountable for their behavior. We’re a long way off from transitioning into how to deal with matters such as accountability.

Church. Brains run on math the same as everything else in the universe, and math isn't multiple choice (shut up). To hold a series of algorithms responsible for anything is nonsense but there's no current alternative.

[OccultHawk]

Originally Posted by 66Sexy

Church. Brains run on math the same as everything else in the universe, and math isn't multiple choice (shut up). To hold a series of algorithms responsible for anything is nonsense but there's no current alternative.

Yeah. I think I remember you understood this when we discussed it before iirc

That’s pleasing to me because it’s so in your face obvious but still so few people seem to get it.

[The Batlord]

Originally Posted by elphenor

I'm not convinced that because something has a beginning the end is predetermined

I'm not against the idea, I just don't see where the absolute assurance is coming from

what tells you that moment to moment there aren't dice rolls going on

Even a dice roll is predetermined based on how it's thrown, the weight of the dice, what they're landing on, etc.