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Old 08-21-2014, 09:01 AM   #411 (permalink)
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If I paid that much money to look like that I would be showing it off at every opportunity too
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What? No. No. No. No no no.
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Old 08-21-2014, 09:28 AM   #412 (permalink)
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Her looks creep me the **** out. Her music is...blegh.
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Old 08-21-2014, 01:21 PM   #413 (permalink)
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I give dat video 2 thumbs UP
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Old 08-21-2014, 04:47 PM   #414 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Soulflower View Post
I think it is tacky even when J Lo flaunts it but at least when the media insists that J Lo has a nice body, everything on it is actually real versus Nikki.

I can watch whatever I want and form whatever kind of opinion on whatever I want. I like music so I have a right to have my own opinion on it.

There was nothing empowering about this video and the only one who is slut shaming Nikki is Nikki herself.
Your post is full of misogyny tbh. Because Nicki's butt is fake she's not allowed to be proud of her body? It's her music career, it's her choice what she does with everything that relates to her.

The only one slut shaming is you. You are setting standards for her that you have no right to. Next you'll tell me you hate strippers and working girls for selling their sexuality.
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:36 PM   #415 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Vanilla View Post
Your post is full of misogyny tbh. Because Nicki's butt is fake she's not allowed to be proud of her body? It's her music career, it's her choice what she does with everything that relates to her.

The only one slut shaming is you. You are setting standards for her that you have no right to. Next you'll tell me you hate strippers and working girls for selling their sexuality.
How so?

This is not a matter of her being "proud of her body". You can still be proud of your body without exploiting it in a derogatory way.

She is capitalizing off of the sex market period, its not that deep.

She is entitled to do what she wants but I am also entitled to form an opinion on what she does as a consumer.

She professes she wants to be taken seriously as an artist

She has often called out other artists for doing what SHE did in this video

So why can't people hold her accountable?

You act like since I am criticizing the video and "slut shaming" as you say, my opinion is invalid.

This has nothing to do with strippers. So lets stay focus on the topic.

ONCE AGAIN, there is nothing wrong with using sexuality in music but as long as it is done tastefully and artistically. I personally think it defeats the purpose when it is only use to capitalize off of and not to convey a message but once again that is MY opinion.


Madonna did the same thing BUT at least she tried to challenge her listeners in an artistic way. There was a message behind what she did.

Last edited by Soulflower; 08-21-2014 at 08:41 PM.
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Old 08-22-2014, 05:55 AM   #416 (permalink)
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I give dat video 2 thumbs UP
It's filth. So yeah it's quality.
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Old 08-22-2014, 07:44 AM   #417 (permalink)
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This is NOT an opinion argument. It is a true or false(yes or no) question with an absolute answer.
This is the problem right here.

YOU think this discussion on this music video is objective and it is not. How are people's opinion on the video objective? -rhetorical question

I could say Nikki is acting like a slut in the video based on my own opinion and it still would not be objective.

I think Nikki is degrading herself whether she feels that way or not.

That is an opinion. It does not matter whether the issue is on degradation or not.

It does not matter whether she feels that way or not because that is my opinion which I formed after watching the video.

I watched the video and I formed my own opinion.

This entire conversation is subjective.

The fact that you think Nikki is the only person who gets to decide whether she is degrading herself or not is in fact subjective because that is YOUR opinion.

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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
The question is: Nikki do you feel you are degrading yourself by using sex appeal to make money?

When was that a question? This was never a question.

My first response to this video was "Very degrading". You can scroll back to my very first post on this discussion. I never asked a question.

I flat out gave my opinion on what I saw in the video.

You seem to have a hard time deciphering the difference between objective and subjective responses.

You are misinterpreting my responses and making up what you want from this discussion. No where have I asked that question.

I simply gave my opinion on the video which you seem to think you have some type of authority over.

You do not get to decide what is subjective or objective when it comes down to opinions.

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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
(reword it how you like if you don't think this covers the subject matter thoroughly.)
This was never a question that was asked. I simply stated that Nikki was degrading herself and you simply disagreed with it.

This debate is about whether a person is entitled to express whether someone is degrading themselves or not (expressing an opinion) or is it only up to the person in question.

You feel it is only up to the person in question which is beyond absurd because everyone is entitled to have their own opinion whether good or bad.

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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
If her answer is yes than the act is degrading. If her answer is no than the act is NOT degrading. (to HER not you. The question at hand is about Nikki not you)

There are no questions that were asked and Nikki's response to this question is irrelevant because it still would not change the fact that people are entitled to form their own opinion about what she is doing in the video based on her behavior in the video.

If you agreed that people have a right to form their own opinions on what she does, being she is a public figure, why do you continue to argue against people insisting she is degrading herself? Is that not an opinion someone is forming based on the video?


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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
You don't get to have an opinion, SHE decides what is degrading to her.
I most certainly do have the right to form my own opinion on a video that she has made for public consumption regardless whether she feels she is degrading herself or not.

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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
Just because if you were in that situation you would find yourself being degraded doesn't mean that everyone else who puts themselves in that situation are being degraded. You don't get an opinion and neither do I. She makes the decision. Actions are not degrading by nature, degradation is something humans attach to things.
I think it is sad that you honestly believe nobody is entitled (including yourself) to state an opinion that she is degrading herself in the video.

I am trying to get you to understand that her opinion and what she feels is irrelevant because whatever opinion that you form is in fact your opinion. It would not matter what she feels.

This is not an question for Nikki. I watched the video and thought it was very degrading that is simply an opinion I have on the video.


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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
You can take this example and apply it to many things. Embarassment, excitement, etc. You don't get to speak on behalf of others just because it's your opinion.
Anybody can form an opinion about anything. Now I personally feel it is never good to judge anybody as a HUMAN BEING especially if you do not know them personally which is quite different from this discussion.

I am not judging her personally or as a person. I simply stated that the music video which she is marketing for the public is very degrading, which it is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
This discussion is about Nikki and how she feels. Your opinions are essentially putting words in her mouth.

This discussion is about people giving their opinions on a music video, period. I could care less what Nikki thinks of MY opinion on a music video that SHE wants the public (which I am included in) to watch.

If she wants me to watch this video than she needs to be prepared for MY opinion on it regardless of what she thinks about the video.
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Old 08-22-2014, 11:45 AM   #418 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Soulflower View Post
This is what a dictionary defines as degradation
Webster Dictionary:

deg·ra·da·tion
noun \ˌde-grə-ˈdā-shən\

: the act or process of damaging or ruining something

: the act of treating someone or something poorly and without respect
Quote:
First definition: the act or process of ruining something

Nothing about this video is ruining her. If this is the person she wants to be than not allowing her to do this would be more destructive to her character than having people find her tasteless.
Quote:
Second definition: the act of treating someone or something poorly and without respect

If Nikki wants the video to be made this way and flaunt herself than that is the exact opposite of this definition. She is being treated respectfully by having her goal and idea about the music video fulfilled.


An opinion would be, "Nikki should feel degraded by her actions." If you said that we wouldn't be having this discussion. All you're doing is stating a fact a calling it your opinion.

This has been quite fun but I will be removing all my previous posts for the sake of other members. We have derailed the thread quite a bit with our bickering and I don't want other people having to sift through everything. Feel free to PM me or post here if you'd like.
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Last edited by DwnWthVwls; 08-22-2014 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 08-22-2014, 12:38 PM   #419 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DwnWthVwls View Post
An opinion would be, "Nikki should feel degraded by her actions." If you said that we wouldn't be having this discussion.


All you're doing is stating a fact a calling it your opinion.

This has been quite fun but I will be removing all my previous posts for the sake of other members. We have derailed the thread quite a bit with our bickering and I don't want other people having to sift through everything. Feel free to PM me or post here if you'd like.
No I am not. This is actually what you are doing.

I am expressing my opinion on the video.

You are trying to dictate how I should express my opinion which is pointless on your part because I am going to say whatever I feel like saying because it is my opinion.

You do not know the difference between expressing an opinion versus proclaiming something as a fact.
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Old 08-22-2014, 07:23 PM   #420 (permalink)
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And it's pointless debating something with someone so stubborn that won't consider any other facts or opinions. You have come off really nasty in this thread. I've seen you actually thank other people in other threads because they share your opinion but when I made a different opinion you blasted me for it and funnily enough did not thank me for sharing.
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