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Old 07-27-2011, 08:01 PM   #171 (permalink)
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There should be a rock community citizen's arrest warrant for this man. Nothing he has done is innovative and all he serves to do is act as a punching bag for the media. He gives extreme music a bad name and while his image may be interesting, his music is not. Lock him up and throw away the key.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:21 AM   #172 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by skaltezon View Post
I'm not interested in your opinion, which is why I began this thread as a 'Post your videos' thread. Don't have a video? Then STFU.
It needed to be said. And I noticed you didn't post a video in that post either. Trollololol
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:45 PM   #173 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Merkaba View Post
But Manson is actually a very bright guy. He guest lectures at Universities in the states an has been invited to speak at some conferences. It is a shame most youth will never see how smart Manson actually is until they are too nieve to accept that he is brains over image.
I didn't know he did that, I will say that ignoring his freak gimmick, he does seem like a cool guy.
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Old 07-29-2011, 06:03 AM   #174 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Azlein View Post
I love to listen to sweet dreams, right round, and tainted love. His versions are just awesome!
I agree (belatedly). I feel that Marilyn Manson's cover of "Sweet Dreams" is much more disturbed and disturbing than the original by Eurythmics, so it appeals to me more:



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Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur View Post
There should be a rock community citizen's arrest warrant for this man. Nothing he has done is innovative and all he serves to do is act as a punching bag for the media. He gives extreme music a bad name and while his image may be interesting, his music is not. Lock him up and throw away the key.
He's already been locked up, but luckily the key wasn't thrown away.

I disagree with you that Marilyn Manson has done nothing innovative. Even his covers are innovative and carry his own, unique musical and visual style. His music and image are expressive, aggressive, sexual...but not run-of-the mill metal where "macho" men bang their heads around. Manson gives a delicate, sinuous, senuous warped feeling to his music and performances, which are like watching a "soul" explode so that all can see the innards.

Here are two of his songs that I hadn't heard before today and rather like:

Marilyn Manson - "Wormboy"
Has a nice quirky, alternative, but heavy sound.



Marilyn Manson - "Burning Flag"
The song effectively turns anger into sound, in my opinion.



I also find more than his image interesting. I feel his life is interesting. For example, he has made his own path, challenging sexist gender biases in society, and that takes bravery. He also challenges the notion that appearance makes the man:

Marilyn Manson comments on jail (2007) - He talks about how police treated him in jail (not well)



Marilyn Manson at his home - (short documentary) He shows his off-stage life, which includes painting watercolors and appreciating his loved-ones.

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Originally Posted by Neapolitan:
If a chicken was smart enough to be able to speak English and run in a geometric pattern, then I think it should be smart enough to dial 911 (999) before getting the axe, and scream to the operator, "Something must be done! Something must be done!"

Last edited by VEGANGELICA; 07-29-2011 at 06:13 AM.
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Old 07-29-2011, 12:10 PM   #175 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA View Post
I agree (belatedly). I feel that Marilyn Manson's cover of "Sweet Dreams" is much more disturbed and disturbing than the original by Eurythmics, so it appeals to me more:

He's already been locked up, but luckily the key wasn't thrown away.

I disagree with you that Marilyn Manson has done nothing innovative. Even his covers are innovative and carry his own, unique musical and visual style. His music and image are expressive, aggressive, sexual...but not run-of-the mill metal where "macho" men bang their heads around. Manson gives a delicate, sinuous, senuous warped feeling to his music and performances, which are like watching a "soul" explode so that all can see the innards.

I also find more than his image interesting. I feel his life is interesting. For example, he has made his own path, challenging sexist gender biases in society, and that takes bravery. He also challenges the notion that appearance makes the man:

Marilyn Manson comments on jail (2007) - He talks about how police treated him in jail (not well)


Marilyn Manson at his home - (short documentary) He shows his off-stage life, which includes painting watercolors and appreciating his loved-ones.
Last I checked, the guards in prison don't treat anyone well. The bottom line is that his music wasn't interesting or good enough to stand on its own two legs so he created his image as gimmick to sell records. There's so much better music in the realm of industrial rock.

As for those run-of-the-mill metal bands, at least they didn't have to get breast augmentations to sell records and get people to take notice of them.
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Old 08-01-2011, 02:09 PM   #176 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur View Post
The bottom line is that his music wasn't interesting or good enough to stand on its own two legs so he created his image as gimmick to sell records. There's so much better music in the realm of industrial rock.
I think you're carelessly dismissing a lot of creative music because you're offended by the rest of the package. There's no rule that good music has to be heard in a vacuum without the imagery that Manson employs so well. But here's one of many Manson songs that's original and musically interesting on its own. If you hate the guy so much that you can't stand the sound of his voice, try listening to some String Quartet tributes.

A Place In The Dirt

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Old 08-01-2011, 02:53 PM   #177 (permalink)
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Manson owns
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Old 08-01-2011, 03:15 PM   #178 (permalink)
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I liked his music in middle school. However, I hated the fruity emos kids that liked it in my school. They made me mad, mainly because their very nature was contradictory ("Let's go against the grain but all dress exactly the same as each other"). Manson truly goes against the grain though. His music is alright, but he isn't much different than a creepy Lady Gaga. Theatrics. I think Trent Reznor beat him to the punch, just without all the makeup and surgeries.

I'm sure the link is on this thread somewhere so I won't bother posting it, but I've always loved the video for "Beautiful People".
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Old 08-01-2011, 11:08 PM   #179 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur View Post
Last I checked, the guards in prison don't treat anyone well. The bottom line is that his music wasn't interesting or good enough to stand on its own two legs so he created his image as gimmick to sell records. There's so much better music in the realm of industrial rock.

As for those run-of-the-mill metal bands, at least they didn't have to get breast augmentations to sell records and get people to take notice of them.
I agree that music should be interesting on its own, even without the musicians' appearances playing a role. Sometimes, though, a good show or an unusual presentation can make the music have even more impact.

Marilyn Manson's image didn't make me listen to his songs when I first heard of him back in the early 90's...and I didn't even know until your post that he had breast implants. In fact, when I was younger I was afraid of him and avoided his music *because* his image scared me.

My feeling is that his "gimmick" is just part of his artistry, which is an expression of himself. How do you tell the difference between a "gimmick" and a person's genuine desire to show visually who he or she is? Even a drab, average-looking musician is choosing to present herself or himself that way, and probably for a reason (such as not to look "gimmicky")...so wouldn't that *also* be a "gimmick," a way to appeal to certain people?

Skaltezon posted one of Marilyn Manson's original songs earlier. Here is one of his that I like even more, and I feel this song stands up well on its own (no visuals needed):

Marilyn Manson - "Get Your Gunn"



Marilyn Manson (Brian Warner) helped write the lyrics. In my opinion they are very clever because they quickly and poetically convey the perspective of the song, which I view as desiring to break through society's moral "rules" and rebelliously challenge those who withhold information and stifle imagination in their attempt to keep us on a "righteous" path:

Quote:
Excerpts from the lyrics of "Get Your Gunn"

Goddamn your righteous hand.

I eat innocent meat.
The housewife I will beat.
The prolife I will kill.
What you don't do, I will.

I hate therefore I am.

Pseudo-morals work real well
on the talk shows for the weak.
Selective judgements and goodguy badges
don't mean a **** to me.

The most that I can learn
is in the records that you burn.

MARILYN MANSON - GET YOUR GUNN LYRICS
About prison: I think Marilyn was in *jail*, not prison...which makes me think you probably haven't been in either in order to check how guards act! Never having been in jail or prison myself, I don't know how all guards treat all prisoners, but I suspect that most male prisoners aren't told to wash their lipstick off in the toilet, as Marilyn Manson was told to do, because few men wear lipstick.

The point is that Marilyn Manson *has* faced a lot of social criticism because his music and image challenge society's claim that it supports freedom of speech, freedom of religion (or lack of it), and a large amount of freedom in personal appearance choices. The guards at the jail where he was held symbolize society's discomfort with someone who breaks the "rules" and encourages others to question the rules that confine them.
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Originally Posted by Neapolitan:
If a chicken was smart enough to be able to speak English and run in a geometric pattern, then I think it should be smart enough to dial 911 (999) before getting the axe, and scream to the operator, "Something must be done! Something must be done!"
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Old 08-01-2011, 11:34 PM   #180 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Metal Connoisseur View Post
As for those run-of-the-mill metal bands, at least they didn't have to get breast augmentations to sell records and get people to take notice of them.
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Originally Posted by VEGANGELICA View Post
I didn't even know until your post that he had breast implants.
What??? Does no one question such improbable tales before repeating them?
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