NBA thread

[Laces Out Dan!]

Originally Posted by dac

Don't forget Sasha Pavlovic who's got the most potential out of all of them.

Ah shit, How could I have forgot about Sasha..im a a big fan of him. Hes a real player.

[dac]

Originally Posted by LesPaul43

Ah shit, How could I have forgot about Sasha..im a a big fan of him. Hes a real player.

He's the reason I'd like to see Wally dealt for a big guy. While I like what Wally's doing, he just simply doesn't have the skill on the defensive end to be there for us in the playoffs, plus I'd like to see Sasha play more. And just a LITTLE more production from down low would put the Cavs over the top.

Just think: The Celtics arguably got worse from last season with the loss of Posey and the Cavs are significantly better than last season and they STILL pushed the Celtics to 7 games last year. If Paul Pierce hadn't played the game of his life, they wouldn't even have made it out of the second round. Now I'm a biased Cleveland fan, but right now I'd take the Cavs to come out of the East.

[Laces Out Dan!]

Im not sure the Celts got worse. I dont think too much of Posey, and Rondo is turning into one of the best points in the league.

[ProggyMan]

Originally Posted by dac

Z is fantastic, and it showed how good he was when you watched the cavs play without him. I was on the "get rid of Z" bandwagon a couple of years ago, but as someone who watches essentially every cavs game, he is the next most vital piece next to LeBron. Calling Mo a shoot first point guard who doesn't have much range takes a lot away from him. His niche is that pull up mid range jumper. Delonte West shoots the 3s. Our ONLY weakness is a lack of offensive skill from the big men besides Z.

Z still gets dominated by stronger, more athletic centers, and while that isn't a huge weakness now, when Bynum and Gasol come to town I think you'll see just how overmatched the Cavs are up front. The Lakers have a deeper, more talented bench, a stronger front line and a better star player (Sorry Lebron, Kobe's still got you there).

[dac]

Originally Posted by LesPaul43

Im not sure the Celts got worse. I dont think too much of Posey, and Rondo is turning into one of the best points in the league.

I'm a big Posey fan, but that's a good point, Rondo is probably better than Ray Allen to be honest.

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

Z still gets dominated by stronger, more athletic centers, and while that isn't a huge weakness now, when Bynum and Gasol come to town I think you'll see just how overmatched the Cavs are up front. The Lakers have a deeper, more talented bench, a stronger front line and a better star player (Sorry Lebron, Kobe's still got you there).

And do you think Bynum/Gasol can score from the mid range like he can? Between Varejao and Wallace there's plenty of defense to cover LA's big men. The only two who really give Z troubles are Shaq, Yao, and with the way Dwight Howard as played this year probably him. The only one of those Z will see in the playoffs is Howard, and I think the Magic are still one good starter from being an elite team.

[ProggyMan]

And do you think Bynum/Gasol can score from the mid range like he can?

Gasol can score better from everywhere, including three.

Between Varejao and Wallace there's plenty of defense to cover LA's big men.

Too bad they're both offense liabilities (Less so for Varejao, but he's too small to compete with Gasol and Bynum around the rim).

The only two who really give Z troubles are Shaq, Yao, and with the way Dwight Howard as played this year probably him.

You really don't think a long physical, athletically gifted player like Bynum who will only get better as the season progresses won't give Z fits in the low post?

The only one of those Z will see in the playoffs is Howard, and I think the Magic are still one good starter from being an elite team.

Agreed, I think Courtney Lee was an excellent pick and if he and Nelson continue to develop apace the Magic will be just as good as the Cavs and Celtics in 2-3 years, maybe even next year.

[dac]

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

Gasol can score better from everywhere, including three.

Z has actually been money from 3 this year, though he rarely goes out there. Mid range Z is better, period.

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

Too bad they're both offense liabilities (Less so for Varejao, but he's too small to compete with Gasol and Bynum around the rim).

Varejao is 6-11, athletic, and tries harder than anybody... he can handle Gasol and Bynum

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

You really don't think a long physical, athletically gifted player like Bynum who will only get better as the season progresses won't give Z fits in the low post?

Most of Z's scoring is from jump shots, turn arounds, tip ins, and hooks. Rarely does he back somebody down and take it to the hole, so no, I'm not worried.

Also the Cavs looked like shit tonight, and couldn't make a shot to save their lives. It didn't help that the refs had no idea what was going on.

[ProggyMan]

Z has actually been money from 3 this year, though he rarely goes out there. Mid range Z is better, period.

Can you back that up? Show me some stats that say Z has a better midrange game than Gasol.

Varejao is 6-11, athletic, and tries harder than anybody... he can handle Gasol and Bynum

He's not strong enough or long enough to match up with Bynum, and he's still an offensive liability.

Most of Z's scoring is from jump shots, turn arounds, tip ins, and hooks. Rarely does he back somebody down and take it to the hole, so no, I'm not worried.

I know he can score, my questions are about defense and rebounding.

[dac]

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

Can you back that up? Show me some stats that say Z has a better midrange game than Gasol.

Can you show me some stats otherwise? You're the one that said Gasol could score better from everywhere... (Don't though, both are great scorers, and if one really is better than the other, it's not by much)

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

He's not strong enough or long enough to match up with Bynum, and he's still an offensive liability.

Ben Wallace is the offensive liability. Varejao is competent enough to score.

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

I know he can score, my questions are about defense and rebounding.

Z play solid, not great D, and can grab boards too. There's a reason he's the Cavs all-time leading rebounder you know.

[ProggyMan]

Can you show me some stats otherwise? You're the one that said Gasol could score better from everywhere... (Don't though, both are great scorers, and if one really is better than the other, it's not by much)

Gasol scores more and takes the same percentage of midrange shots as Ilgauskas.

Ben Wallace is the offensive liability. Varejao is competent enough to score.

He can make open layups, unlike Wallace, but he can't score back to the basket.

Z play solid, not great D, and can grab boards too. There's a reason he's the Cavs all-time leading rebounder you know.

Which isn't saying much...I know he's competent defensively and considering the lack of 'true' centers, one of the best in the league, excellent scorer, but bottom line the Lakers are deeper, bigger, stronger and more athletic on the front line. Their backcourt is better too...I can't see a single area of the gvme, except maybe defense in the halfcourt game, where the Cavs are better.