Thom Yorke

Wow, I couldn't disagree more. I've been arguing Moss over Rice for years actually (which I know sounds like blasphemy, but I stand by that). The point is that there has never been an athlete like Moss to come into the league, ever, and there likely won't be for the forseeable future. His measurables are out of this world. He came in with a 50+ vertical and 4.2 speed, while being 6'4. There just isn't a way to cover that. Add in his hands and boundary awareness and the guy truly is a freak.

It's not a coincidence that he's played on the two highest scoring offenses of all time. Even when he's not making big catches he can completely take over games because he always requires special attention. Yes, TO has physicality over him, but frankly it doesn't really matter when you are so dominant in a certain asect of the game that you completely take the top off the defense everytime you're on the field. And he wasn't strictly about the long ball, although it was definitely his main draw.

And I'm speaking in the past tense because he's at one of those points in his career where he's clearly not trying right now. We've seen it before and we'll see it again. I have no doubts that if he wants to play again, he will go right back to dominating.

Dirty

Moss over RICE??? Man, I can't take anyone over Rice, ever. He is like the Michael Jordan or Gretzky of receivers.

I used to be a Moss over Owens guy, but after a point I couldn't defend his extreme lack of effort anymore. If Randy TRIED as hard as TO, he probably would be the greatest WR ever. He is a total freak, to be that tall and that fast with those leaps is just something we might not ever see again. And part of his game is being lazy cause he'll jog down field 4 times and then the 5th time he will accelerate and he'll blow by anyone. Those years in Minnesota were awesome, I still look up some of those highlight reels. Culpepper just bombing it to Randy and it was just impossible to overthrow him. He's the best deep ball WR ever, by far, but he just doesn't try half the time. Both are awesome future Hall-of-Famers but I gotta go with TO for his sheer toughness and more versatility at the position. When Owens came back from that broken leg with the Eagles to play in the superbowl, it made me a TO fan for life.

Thom Yorke

Lol, yep. I'm not a big stats guy at all, so I don't put much emphasis into Rice's records. I mean just look at the QBs the guy had throwing to him. I also disagree with Gretzky being the best hockey player but that's another story.

Moss does have character issues, there's no denying that. And yes he has been caught dogging it on plays when he's not happy. However, when he's in a situation he likes, there is no questioning his work ethic, and the guy is near impossible to stop. And he's done it enough times and in enough different places for me to label him as the best.

Dirty

Fair enough. Like I said, it's picking between two automatic Hall of Famers so you can't go wrong with either.

Bobby Orr? Lemieux? Who you got as the best hockey player?

Bloozcrooz

I see the argument your making with Moss. Definatley a freak of nature with his ability and height. Along with several other factors that contribute to his overall nack for the position. Ive always been a fan of his and have witnessed some amazing catches over the years. Still I think its a little early to annoint him the King of receiving ahead of Rice. You also have to take into consideration the era in which these two were playing in. At the begining and most of Rices career the game was not a pass dominant league. It was quite the opposite. Rice really didnt have all the natural abillity of a Moss. His work ethic was bar none and he had excellent route running abillities. Thats whats landed him the overall leader of the statistic books in almost every category there is. It wasnt until Young arrived to replace Montana that the epic west coast offense started to take effect. Which is exzactly the style of offense Brady and the Pats run. Point being in Rices day the yards were a little harder to come by for a receiver. However ive enjoyed and appreciate being able too watch both these great through the years.Its almost sad when you think what Moss could have accomplished if he applied hisself every down. But thats the Randy we all know and love though and openly admits he doesnt give it his all every down...which is actually funny to me. I still like the guy and enjoy his press conferences in which he taunts the media. Either way the guy can ball when he wants to but better than Rice????ehhh not sure if I would go to that extent. At any rate heres one of his epic rants..lol..

Thom Yorke

For sure. It was Moss, Owens, Harrison and Holt for the receivers of their generation, all guarunteed HOFers.

For me it's Orr, hands down. When people think of best player, all they really think about is offense and records. Orr gave you the best of both worlds, offensively and defensively. Gretzky is definitely the best offensive player ever but Orr is up there for the best of all time in both areas. Not to mention he was tough as nails and would fight regularly, something you can't say about Gretzky.

Also, Orr also revolutionized the game like no one else. Puckmoving defensemen seem to be all the craze today, and the piece that every team covets. That isn't possible without Orr. He was the first to rush the puck up the ice regularly, but still get back to help out defenisvely. He influenced Bourque/Coffey, who influenced Leetch/Niedermayer, who influenced Keith/Doughty, etc. Gretzky had his impact on the game for sure. He really paved the way for behind the net playmaking and hitting the trailer on odd-man rushes, but Orr changed the definition of an entire position, and completely changed gameplans.

And the last main point is supporting cast. Orr had Esposito, but not a whole lot else on those Bruins teams. Gretzky on the other hand basically had a dream team in Edmonton. I mean, they won the cup a couple years after trading Gretzky.

Thom Yorke

I wouldn't say I completely disregard stats, but I really put minimal weight into them, so it's pretty tough to have an argument with me about Rice vs. Moss because stats always seem to be the backbone of any Rice argument. When I'm evaluating players I'm basically only going off of what I see of them, how much they help their team, and how well they hold up year to year. When I look at Moss, the measurables speak for themselves. And when you look at the long list of players that have had success when Moss was on their team and then have basically disapeared afterwards, his impact on his team is pretty easy to see.

And yes, he's one of the best for quotables too. I thought this mix sums him up pretty well:

Bloozcrooz

Lmao!!...Man I love that guy..Im all for the player taunting the media and speaking their mind. It never gets old watching the Moss's, T.O.'s, and other players stirring up the wasp nests. Of course you have to have the talent to back it up. You cant be an average caliber player and expect to survive the return fire from the media. I think it brings a whole nother approach to the game and makes it all that more interesting. T.O. use to say if you want me to shut up..then shut me up. Some players like Rice just had that quiet classy demeanor about them. Which is fine and very respectable, but I also like the loud flambouyant ones. They seem to get under the skin of their opponent and use it to their advantage during a game.

ThePhanastasio

This is memorable, although probably my most hated sports moment ever:



WHY, Rick Pitino?! Why did you not defend the inbound pass?!

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Bloozcrooz

This wasnt a game winning epic play or anything of that nature, but memorable yes. I laughed uncontrollably when I saw this highlight. Totally out of charactor for Andre to behave like that. If you know anything about football you know that he is probaly 99% of the time a humble man. One if not the best receiver in football at this time. His opponent was outmatched and he knew it. So he baited him into getting thrown out of the game. Not without receiving several blows from ol number 80. That im sure will be in the back of his mind every time these two line up across from each other from now on. Makes for good heighlight reel action though, and funny commentary from NFL Network. Deion, and the guys making fun of Finnegan for getting pretty much whooped on national.... television.