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boo boo 06-30-2009 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr dave (Post 464030)
just going to make a few points based on some of the stuff i've seen in this thread, not going to quote everyone.

the idea that bassists are failed guitarists only applies to the connect the dot style of rock where the bass player only hits the root of whatever chord the guitar player is playing at the same time as the bass drum hit.

a good bass player that understands the role of establishing and maintaining a groove within the context of the band is rare and requires a whole other set of skills than those you normally develop on a guitar. it seems a lot of time bands end up with someone who should really be playing guitar. i'm not saying there isn't room for bass leads outside of jazz, but trying to solo on a bass the same way you do on a guitar sounds cheesy. conversely a bass player should be allowed to do more than pedal point the root of the riff.

as for my own low end dealings. i've got 2 basses. one is a 4 string aria pro II - cat series. weighs a ton, sounds great. the other is a 5 string fretless by samick. weighs little, neckdives like there's no tomorrow, but gets surprisingly deep low end.

flea became a monstrous influence on me as a teen. not just in terms of playing bass but also the way he dealt with music. he might not be on the same level as wooten and pastorius but in terms of what's available to mainstream music listeners he's definitely a great starting point to learn about more than what you hear on tv and radio.

i also really dig all the old sabbath riffs, geezer butler is definitely worthy of praise. his technique of not loosing the groove when playing lead fills is freaking ace.

scott reeder from kyuss also deserves a mention in the sludgy groove based hard rock vein that butler started.

i also seem to remember all three guys in spinal tap playing basses for 'big bottom' haha. although if memory serves me correctly smalls had an 8 sting. soundgarden does a pretty good cover of that track too hehehe.
Well, I did take up the bass because I failed at the guitar.

For me, the problem with guitar was all about chords. I couldn't play them.

So bass is a more natural fit for me. You just play scales and individual notes, that's a lot easier to learn, though it's still a bitch to master, especially when rhythm comes into play.

I wish I had more confidence in my ability to learn, I don't practice nearly as much as I should.

mr dave 06-30-2009 04:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 695446)
Well, I did take up the bass because I failed at the guitar.

For me, the problem with guitar was all about chords. I couldn't play them.

So bass is a more natural fit for me. You just play scales and individual notes, that's a lot easier to learn, though it's still a bitch to master, especially when rhythm comes into play.

I wish I had more confidence in my ability to learn, I don't practice nearly as much as I should.
yeah but you also stand as one of the more 'unique' people i've come across on the net. coming from me that puts you WAY out there hahaha

as for bass being just scales and notes, yes and no. you can't really chug power chords the same way as you do on a guitar but it's still a viable option when you're playing on the top 2 strings. playing a full chord arpeggio on a bass also sounds really really nice especially if you find a way to incorporate a ringing open string or harmonic into the mix.

personally i enjoyed practicing my guitar far more than my bass. playing with people is where i really developed my bass playing chops. i know it's easier said than done but if you can manage to find your way into a 'good' improv session it'll do wonders for your playing.

boo boo 06-30-2009 04:36 PM
I would like to join an actual band eventually, it would help the learning process a lot.

Probably a folk, country or punk band, or a blues rock band. Something that requires simple walking or strumming basslines

Antonio 06-30-2009 04:53 PM
i just want to say that i play both, and the way that i play on guitar, i almost entirely mimic when i'm playing bass. i mean there are a few differences, i.e. barre chords/slapping popping, but for the most part i like extended fingerpicking and improvising as well as use of triad forms and open notes too. for me, it's not about what's "easier", but how i could get a different tone and sound as well as be a bit of a new challenge each time.

one thing i realized when i started playing bass for my band was how in that genre i fit better as a bassist than as a guitarist. not so much that it's easier or anything, but because when playing guitar, i hate to be confined in things like strumming power chords for the majority of the song, and like i said before with im usually improvising or trying to use different chord forms. i found that that fit alot better with bass, because i could add things to the song my own way.

oh and boo boo, joining a band or even jamming with others can help you ALOT, because you can share ideas with musicians and learn how to work with a group musically.

mr dave 06-30-2009 05:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 695649)
I would like to join an actual band eventually, it would help the learning process a lot.

Probably a folk, country or punk band, or a blues rock band. Something that requires simple walking or strumming basslines
don't fool yourself into thinking those are easy styles to play simply because of the technical simplicity involved. especially folk and country, those styles require LOTS of restraint and an excellent sense of timing. it's one thing to keep that same pendulum feel going for a song, it's another thing to keep that same feeling going for a set. it's far more of a mental challenge than a physical one.

blues rock is GREAT for getting your feet wet as it provides ample opportunity to bust loose during instrumental vamps while still maintaining relative simplicity during the more structured parts.

like Antonio said, joining a band or just jamming with others WILL be beneficial. you might not always see the direct benefit depending on the people involved but it's there.

boo boo 06-30-2009 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr dave (Post 695716)
don't fool yourself into thinking those are easy styles to play simply because of the technical simplicity involved. especially folk and country, those styles require LOTS of restraint and an excellent sense of timing. it's one thing to keep that same pendulum feel going for a song, it's another thing to keep that same feeling going for a set. it's far more of a mental challenge than a physical one.

blues rock is GREAT for getting your feet wet as it provides ample opportunity to bust loose during instrumental vamps while still maintaining relative simplicity during the more structured parts.

like Antonio said, joining a band or just jamming with others WILL be beneficial. you might not always see the direct benefit depending on the people involved but it's there.
I don't have to worry about restraint, I have nothing to hold back. :laughing:

Ricochet~kun 06-30-2009 07:00 PM
okay, ph34r:
i saw this video today:

and i almost shat in my pants.
as of right now, there is nothing i want to do with my live other than strings and bass. so, anyone have good recomendations on bass gear? im starting today, and i need a bass ( i think 2 hundred watt speakers and a gutiar amp should work for a while ) but i have 2 or 3 years of gutiar experiance so im not totally in the dust. but the bass... its just so... so... i dont even know.
like when the groove slows and the pump rolls.
then the bass grows.
and some basic info would help, like,
do bassists in rock bands usually use distortion like the guitarists do?
what diffrent about the way the right hand manipulates the intrument?
are the huge fret spaces difficult to work with?

(ps. im not giving up guitar or any other intruments to learn bass, im just adding bass to the list)

mr dave 06-30-2009 07:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 695744)
I don't have to worry about restraint, I have nothing to hold back. :laughing:
that's exactly how you'll trip up hahaha

ElephantSack 06-30-2009 07:23 PM
Favorite bass? My Schecter Stiletto Custom 5.
I like to mix it up when it comes to style. I'm mainly a finger player. I like to throw in some slaps, taps and sweeps. I use a pick on only one song.
Favorite bassist? Noel Redding, Les Claypool, Cliff Burton, Colin Marston, Fat Mike, Steve Harris

mr dave 06-30-2009 07:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkloring (Post 695807)
okay, ph34r:
i saw this video today:

and i almost shat in my pants.
as of right now, there is nothing i want to do with my live other than strings and bass. so, anyone have good recomendations on bass gear? im starting today, and i need a bass ( i think 2 hundred watt speakers and a gutiar amp should work for a while ) but i have 2 or 3 years of gutiar experiance so im not totally in the dust. but the bass... its just so... so... i dont even know.
like when the groove slows and the pump rolls.
then the bass grows.
and some basic info would help, like,
do bassists in rock bands usually use distortion like the guitarists do?
what diffrent about the way the right hand manipulates the intrument?
are the huge fret spaces difficult to work with?

(ps. im not giving up guitar or any other intruments to learn bass, im just adding bass to the list)
yawn... check out some live squarepusher if you want pants pooping bass action. this guy is alright, his right hand technique is top notch, but overall meh.

do NOT run a bass through a guitar amp. you can run a guitar through a bass amp but you're asking for problems if you go the other way around.

as for the basic info you wonder about....

distortion? depends on the band, when it comes to bass less is usually more. i run mine through a russian big muff.

right hand action? entirely dependent on you. i used to slap and pop back in the late 90s, it's not something i do anymore. that's the technique buddy is using in that video, you slap your thumb on the strings in a percussive way and the noodley bits are done by pulling the higher strings with opposing fingertips so the string slaps against the fretboard. you'll notice that he's really only playing 3 octave patterns over and over for this clip until the very end.

the only time i use my right hand thumb on my bass strings now is a weird double slap thing i sometimes do in tandem with my little finger. my main technique during the last jam room was 3 fingers or a pick. there's no real limit to what you can use to attack the strings with.

fret size? never was an issue for me. the biggest issue i found when going back and forth between instruments was my reflex shape for certain chord shapes became warped after playing the bass for extended periods. you'll find you've got more finger strength and a greater reach when you go back to those puny little guitar necks hahaha

Son of JayJamJah 06-30-2009 07:38 PM
Just decided to pull the trigger on a stand-up five.

Can not wait to sit down and starting learning this one.

Any other stand-up players with advice on making the adjustment from bass guitar?

Ricochet~kun 06-30-2009 09:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr dave (Post 695838)
yawn... check out some live squarepusher if you want pants pooping bass action. this guy is alright, his right hand technique is top notch, but overall meh.

do NOT run a bass through a guitar amp. you can run a guitar through a bass amp but you're asking for problems if you go the other way around.

as for the basic info you wonder about....

distortion? depends on the band, when it comes to bass less is usually more. i run mine through a russian big muff.

right hand action? entirely dependent on you. i used to slap and pop back in the late 90s, it's not something i do anymore. that's the technique buddy is using in that video, you slap your thumb on the strings in a percussive way and the noodley bits are done by pulling the higher strings with opposing fingertips so the string slaps against the fretboard. you'll notice that he's really only playing 3 octave patterns over and over for this clip until the very end.

the only time i use my right hand thumb on my bass strings now is a weird double slap thing i sometimes do in tandem with my little finger. my main technique during the last jam room was 3 fingers or a pick. there's no real limit to what you can use to attack the strings with.

fret size? never was an issue for me. the biggest issue i found when going back and forth between instruments was my reflex shape for certain chord shapes became warped after playing the bass for extended periods. you'll find you've got more finger strength and a greater reach when you go back to those puny little guitar necks hahaha
well truely, the bass makes the guitar look like a toy, imo.
so, do you think the person in the vid is using distortion? its really hard for me to tell, being so used to the tiny crushy guitar sound

mr dave 06-30-2009 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkloring (Post 695993)
well truely, the bass makes the guitar look like a toy, imo.
so, do you think the person in the vid is using distortion? its really hard for me to tell, being so used to the tiny crushy guitar sound
nope. no fuzz on that bass.

you want a good example of distortion on a bass?



there's a clear distinction when he turns it off after a little over a minute.

mr dave 06-30-2009 11:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayJamJah (Post 695846)
Just decided to pull the trigger on a stand-up five.

Can not wait to sit down and starting learning this one.

Any other stand-up players with advice on making the adjustment from bass guitar?
i've only ever tried a stand-up 4. i've had a few people tell me they can see me with an electric stand-up someday, who knows haha.

the one thing i noticed most in my limited experience was how different the strings felt. it's like building up a whole new set of callouses especially on your plucking hand. the action is also a lot higher than a typical electric too.

i'm looking forward to reading about your progress with the new beast :thumb:

boo boo 07-01-2009 09:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr dave (Post 695838)
do NOT run a bass through a guitar amp.
Yeah man, I wish someone would have told me that before.

It was like a f*cking bombshell went off.

Ricochet~kun 07-01-2009 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 696230)
Yeah man, I wish someone would have told me that before.

It was like a f*cking bombshell went off.
what if my speakers are ****ing massive and have huge woofers?

boo boo 07-01-2009 01:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkloring (Post 696254)
what if my speakers are ****ing massive and have huge woofers?
I still wouldn't try it.

Surely a cheap bass amp can't be that hard to find.

Son of JayJamJah 07-01-2009 01:08 PM
Boo Boo

Something like this would work great.

Epiphone Studio Bass 10S - eBay (item 260437827522 end time Jul-05-09 18:40:03 PDT)

mr dave 07-01-2009 03:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkloring (Post 696254)
what if my speakers are ****ing massive and have huge woofers?
bigger repair bill once the cone in the speakers shred themselves.

Ricochet~kun 07-02-2009 10:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr dave (Post 696430)
bigger repair bill once the cone in the speakers shred themselves.
i actually had a friend over today, and i plugged the bass in (a squire P-Bass) into my guitar amp and nothing really happened. i dont play very loud, and if i need to, ill probably buy a bass amp. i dont know. maybe i was lucky my speakers are still intact =P

note: i dont mean like a gutiar cabnent, these are the kind of speakers you put in your trunk and blast like insanity

but more importantly, what kind of bass would you suggest for slap/funk?

gunnels 07-02-2009 11:17 AM
I actually ran my bass though a mini guitar amp because I forgot to bring my bass amp.
The tone I recieved was awful, but I didn't break it for some reason.

Antonio 07-02-2009 11:21 AM
it'll only really break if you turn it up high enough, which is why they're not the best option for gigging and playing shows.


for practicing, they're not bad. bass amp is definately better, but not bad.

gunnels 07-02-2009 11:46 AM
I was half-hoping it would break, the guy who owned the amp was a dick

mr dave 07-02-2009 05:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnels (Post 697066)
I actually ran my bass though a mini guitar amp because I forgot to bring my bass amp.
The tone I recieved was awful, but I didn't break it for some reason.
it's not an automatic plug it in and BOOM! explosion!!! situation haha but you're not doing any good to the speaker or amp by running a bass through it. like Antonio said, it likely wouldn't last a gig.

bhoyal 07-03-2009 09:42 AM
Axes: Early 70's Fender J-bass and 1980's Guild Pilot...Laney Mosfet DP Series Bass Amp (early 90's)...80's Boss Stereo Chorus and other various effects at times.

Favorite bassist?
Jack Bruce, Stanley Clarke, Geddy Lee. Chris Squire, Roger Waters, etc...

just_call_me_six 07-04-2009 08:22 AM
favorite bass: anything weird looking

favorite bassists: steve harris, cliff burton

J.S.3otR 08-10-2009 10:16 PM
i play an ibanez bass with an acoustic amp.

the best bass player of all time is steve harris, and i like victor wooten too. well skillwise i might have them backwards but i like harris more just because he plays the kind of music i listen to..

sorry for the bump. i just was eager to find a bass thread so i searched for it

Camerjoe 09-09-2009 02:06 AM
I play a Ibanez SDGR.

Favorite bassists
Les Claypool - My kind of music :)
Victor Wooten - The god of all

Victor is for sure the most skilled bassist I have come across, yet, Les Claypool is my kind of bassist.

Keep this Thread going!

Astronomer 09-10-2009 07:48 PM
So by now most of you are probably aware that I want to learn bass pretty badly... I still haven't made my purchase yet because I'm having second thoughts.

Is it possible to learn the bass if you have really small hands and fingers? Because my hands are quite tiny. I can play piano and guitar amply but everything about the bass is just fatter. They are strong and flexible, just small.

Thoughts, opinions? Apologies for the copious amount of questions.

Farfisa 09-10-2009 08:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lateralus (Post 733756)
So by now most of you are probably aware that I want to learn bass pretty badly... I still haven't made my purchase yet because I'm having second thoughts.

Is it possible to learn the bass if you have really small hands and fingers? Because my hands are quite tiny. I can play piano and guitar amply but everything about the bass is just fatter. They are strong and flexible, just small.

Thoughts, opinions? Apologies for the copious amount of questions.
Alot of small chicks play bass... for example, Rika mm, Elizabeth Hart, Paz Lenchantin. It feels really weird trying out a bass for the first time if you play the guitar. I have relatively big hands and it still felt a little awkward. Well anyway why not try a short scale bass first...

Antonio 09-10-2009 10:22 PM
honestly, when you start practicing bass, expect to stretch out your fingers a bit, but no, having small hands isn't that big of a setback.

Neapolitan 09-10-2009 11:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lateralus (Post 733756)
So by now most of you are probably aware that I want to learn bass pretty badly... I still haven't made my purchase yet because I'm having second thoughts.

Is it possible to learn the bass if you have really small hands and fingers? Because my hands are quite tiny. I can play piano and guitar amply but everything about the bass is just fatter. They are strong and flexible, just small.


Thoughts, opinions? Apologies for the copious amount of questions.
(Unless a person is 6'5" everyone is kinda small to play bass)
As far as having small hands it shouldn't matter too much when playing bass. because you can just switch positions (move around on the fretboard) to play one note to the next,
So if you want to play bass but are apprehensive because of small hands look for shorter scale bass. I have a Fender Musicmaster Bass (Vista Series). It's 30" short scale bass, a regular Fender bass is 34" long. Having a shorter scale bass make it so much more comfortable to play then a regular bass.

Astronomer 09-11-2009 01:45 AM
Awesome, thanks for the advice everyone. If I do eventually buy one I might look at getting a shorter scale one. Are they still as common as regular length basses though? 'Cause I'm thinking I might check out a second hand place and my options may be limited.

mr dave 09-11-2009 03:13 AM
consider flea and the way he plays (and played) his bass.

he's about 5'6". as in, about 2 inches taller than the average north american woman, or... a short guy. with appropriately sized hands for his height (as in not freakishly huge)

have you tried any actual basses yet? borrowed one from a bandmate for the weekend just to fool around a bit?

Astronomer 09-12-2009 12:33 AM
^ Oh all the time. Whenever mates come over to jam I always hop on someone's bass and fiddle around... it's one of the reasons why I've decided to take it up because I just love its groove and how it feels to play it... more chunky (I can't really explain lol) than piano and guitar, other instruments I've learned.

But despite fiddling around on mate's basses lots I'm still worried that having small 'delicate' (I guess?) hands will be my downfall when I try learning the instrument in more detail and progressing further. A lot of people say bass is physically harder to play than guitar/ piano and I guess this is what I'm a bit worried about.

Anyway, I have a friend who is selling a bass and amp. I'm not sure what make it is yet but as far as I've heard she is selling it pretty damn cheaply so I might go for it!

FaSho 09-12-2009 07:58 AM
Well I've been playing the bass for awhile, and decided I want to try stand-up. Any major differances?

Antonio 09-12-2009 08:53 AM
uhhhh......like bigger strings and high as **** action, not to mention no frets if you were originally on a fretted bass.

gunnels 09-12-2009 09:57 AM
I mess with the standups at school alot. MUCH larger fingerboards, no frets, thicker strings etc.
Still fun to mess around with though.

Farfisa 09-12-2009 01:06 PM
Does anyone here have a hollowbody bass? Like a Gibson or an Epiphone?

mr dave 09-12-2009 04:46 PM
@fasho - aside from the size issues as mentioned before, the other major difference you'll notice on an upright from an electric bass is the type of string used. you'll be going from steel to gut / nylon. they'll burn new callouses onto your fingertips.

@lateralus - the idea that playing bass is 'physically harder' than piano or guitar is bollocks. i found the bigger strings made it easier to sound the notes as you have a greater surface area to press down onto the fretboard (as opposed to having a thin wire cutting into your fingertip). the biggest challenge is developing a fingerstyle method if you've been playing with a pic for years.

one other thing to try if you're still concerned about the size is playing octaves. for the vast majority of bass lines octaves will be the biggest stretch you're left hand will face.

try this funky line next time you're noodling on a bass

G--------------------------------------------
D-----3---4---5---6------7---6---5---4------
A--------------------------------------------
E-X-1---2---3---4----X-5---4---3---2--------

keep the low notes fretted with your index finger and the high ones with your little finger. the trick to start is to use your ring finger to reinforce the fretting of the high notes behind your little finger, so you basically end up using two fingers to hold down the higher string but only the tip of your little finger has to reach the high note.



can't comment on hollowbody basses aside from the fact that they look sweet as hell.


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