The Debates (review, cover, income, quote, band)

jibber · 10-15-2008, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam

No. This is the point. It wasn't an informed observation. It was trolling, making unjust accusations from the teats of the Conservative Bullshit Machine. You don't see us commenting on the accusations about McCain's service during Vietnam. Though they might come from far more credible sources than what you've produced (I think Rolling Stone made an article on it), it's still not relevant to the political discussion.

And there's no rule against moderators having an opinion. Ethan might go out of his way now and again to provoke argument, but I feel he was fully justified in this instance. Anything you post here which has no relevance or credible sources can be viewed as spam.

.....actually I've got nothing to add to that, well done.

back to one of the other issues. Seems as if the troopergate investiagtion is going further. there are now two more allegations of ethics violations against palin. One is unrelated to wooten's firing, and the other is a claim that his personnel file was breached illegally by state officials. Now, before I post the article, I just want to clear some things up regarding the significance of the investigation, and what activity is actually being deemed illegal. Palin has the lawful right to fire and hire at will. Her firing of Monegan is perfectly legal. PRESSURING him to fire wooten however, in a joint effort with her husband, is a breach of ehtical law, and considered an abuse of power. This is NOT MY REASONING, this is what was concluded by the Legislature's investigator in a report released last friday. Palin has been concluded to be guilty of abuse of power by the legislature's investigator. THAT is why this is a big deal. Now here's the article that outlines the other two ethics charges against Palin.

Board's Troopergate probe casts wider net: Top Stories | adn.com

Quote:

ETHICS: Investigator hasn't said who else may be under scrutiny.

By TOM KIZZIA
tkizzia@adn.com

Published: October 13th, 2008 11:08 PM
Last Modified: October 13th, 2008 10:58 AM

The state Personnel Board investigation of Gov. Sarah Palin's firing of Walt Monegan has broadened to include other ethics complaints against the governor and examination of actions by other state employees, according to the independent counsel handling the case.

The investigator, Tim Petumenos, did not say who else is under scrutiny. But in two recent letters describing his inquiry, he cited the consolidation of complaints and the involvement of other officials as a reason for not going along with Palin's request to make the examination of her activities more public.

Two other ethics complaints involving Palin are known. One, by activist Andree McLeod, alleges that state hiring practices were circumvented for a Palin supporter. The case is not related to Monegan's firing. The other, by the Public Safety Employees Association, alleges that trooper Mike Wooten's personnel file was illegally breached by state officials.

John Cyr, the PSEA executive director, said Monday the union plans to amend its complaint to be sure the board investigates "harassment" of Wooten as well.

Petumenos has not spoken to the press, in keeping with the secrecy of the state process. But he gave a rough description of the investigation's course in two letters to an Anchorage attorney threatening a lawsuit over Palin's effort to waive confidentiality.

Attention is turning this week to the Personnel Board -- the state's official avenue for investigating ethics complaints -- after release of the Legislature's Troopergate investigation last Friday. The Legislature's investigator concluded that Palin was within her rights to fire Monegan as public safety commissioner, but abused her power and broke the ethics law in joining her husband to push for the firing of Wooten, who was once married to the governor's sister.

Palin reversed an earlier pledge and refused to cooperate with the Legislature's investigation, calling it politically biased. In an unusual twist, she filed the ethics complaint against herself before the board, saying she hoped to "clear the air" by an inquiry through proper channels. She asked the board to decide if she broke ethics laws or acted improperly in dismissing Monegan or in dealing with Wooten -- basically the same ground Branchflower covered.

Petumenos has requested a copy of Friday's legislative report, including confidential backup material, said Sen. Kim Elton, D-Juneau, chairman of the Legislative Council. Elton said the council will meet Thursday to vote on whether to give Petumenos all the material gathered by its investigator, Steve Branchflower.

Petumenos was hired by the Personnel Board to handle the case because the state attorney general's office, which normally investigates ethics charges, would have a conflict investigating the governor.

Under the state's inscrutable system for investigating official ethics complaints, there's no way to tell how long Petumenos' investigation might take. The Personnel Board, made up of three gubernatorial appointees, has meetings scheduled for Oct. 20 and Nov. 3. Agendas for those meetings mention confidential ethics matters to be handled in executive session.

Nor is there any certainty, if the complaints are settled or dismissed, that the results of the investigation will ever be made public. A review of recent Personnel Board cases, however, suggests it's likely most information will eventually be released.

Trauma · 10-15-2008, 03:13 PM

Thanks Jibber, I was a little confused about the actual charges.

sleepy jack · 10-16-2008, 05:14 PM

Well I think Obama is still being way too reserved, but I was glad when he told McCain he got all his information from McCain ads.

lucifer_sam · 10-16-2008, 05:46 PM

Can anyone brief me real quickly on Ron Paul's economic policy (sans prejudice)?

sleepy jack · 10-16-2008, 05:56 PM

He wants to bring back the gold standard and lower all taxes (and completely get rid of income tax and have the government funded purely by excise taxes and tariffs.) He'd lower them all by getting rid of most government funded programs and cutting the size of the federal government down alot. His economic policy is pretty much just cut cut cut.

Double X · 10-16-2008, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sleepy jack

He wants to bring back the gold standard and lower all taxes (and completely get rid of income tax and have the government funded purely by excise taxes and tariffs.) He'd lower them all by getting rid of most government funded programs and cutting the size of the federal government down alot. His economic policy is pretty much just cut cut cut.

I didn't think he was THAT far into the time capsule...

Trauma · 10-16-2008, 09:15 PM

You forgot that he also wants to completely deregulate guns.
With everyone dead, there would be no need for a welfare state or taxes in the first place.

sleepy jack · 10-16-2008, 09:17 PM

I was just talking about his policies relevant to the economy if we're going to get into everything that's wrong with Ron Paul it would be a much longer post.

Trauma · 10-17-2008, 11:02 AM

It was a joke.

ha.

sleepy jack · 10-17-2008, 05:39 PM

Uh okay, well Ron Paul does think more guns will mean less shootings so it's kind of hard to see that was not being serious.

10-15-2008, 03:13 PM	#172 (permalink)
Trauma snickers Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: detroit Posts: 2,194	Thanks Jibber, I was a little confused about the actual charges. __________________ A mi no me importa nada Para mi la vida es un sueño

10-16-2008, 05:46 PM	#174 (permalink)
lucifer_sam Unrepentant Ass-Mod Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 3,921	Can anyone brief me real quickly on Ron Paul's economic policy (sans prejudice)? __________________ first.am

10-16-2008, 09:15 PM	#177 (permalink)
Trauma snickers Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: detroit Posts: 2,194	You forgot that he also wants to completely deregulate guns. With everyone dead, there would be no need for a welfare state or taxes in the first place. __________________ A mi no me importa nada Para mi la vida es un sueño

10-17-2008, 11:02 AM	#179 (permalink)
Trauma snickers Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: detroit Posts: 2,194	It was a joke. ha. __________________ A mi no me importa nada Para mi la vida es un sueño