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Old 04-14-2015, 09:33 AM   #431 (permalink)
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The Wall Street douchebags were probably the most capable people on the planet at figuring out how economics actually work, and yet even they clearly don't know what they're doing, or at least how to divorce their ambitions from their common sense. If some guy whose entire life revolves around knowing how the economy works doesn't know what he's doing, then what the **** chance does anyone else have?

Agreed and bolded for emphasis on the real issue.
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:35 AM   #432 (permalink)
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Any progress the human race has made has generally been in spite of the common man. Was it public discourse among cobblers and farm hands that gave us the US Constitution? No. It was rich, highly educated people who already knew how to govern, probably praying to whatever god they may or may not have believed in that their cretinous constituents wouldn't ruin all their hard work.

And yet, with all of their brilliance, a mere two hundred years later our democracy has become an impotent joke because of said cretins. Occasionally we manage to elect somebody -- through some happy accident -- who kind of knows what they're doing, or at least has a few good ideas that they can manage to implement, but for the most part, the American public continues to prove that they have no business being listened to.

If we can figure out a way to make some kind of constitutional aristocracy like the Roman Republic work, then I'd be all for it. Those rich, educated folk might still be ****ups, but at least they know how actually find Afghanistan on a map.
the rich are still hairless apes

and i really doubt that any species could survive/thrive 'in spite' of the majority of its population

the common man has served a vital role throughout the ages

without slaves & commoners the founding fathers would have probably done their best to try to fit in with the indigenous people of this continent in hopes that they might survive
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:38 AM   #433 (permalink)
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Agreed and bolded for emphasis on the real issue.
Who would you replace them with? Anyone with the same level of knowledge is only going to be as educated because they're making money off of it. And I'm still dubious that even the Wall Street people would have known how to properly interpret the massive scope of the modern world economy.
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:44 AM   #434 (permalink)
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and assuming we can create an intelligent mind that has the capability of surpassing our intellect is also a pretty bold statement to stand behind.
it follows pretty naturally from the assumption that the brain is an organic computer and that all our our mental processes can be explained naturally

if evolution can design our intelligence, and evolution is basically a blind process of trial and error, then it stands to reason that our already intelligent brains can observe the mechanisms by which our intelligence works and use this to sort of reverse-engineer the brain. we can then use this knowledge to engineer an even more powerful model. i mean your premise is basically debunked by the fact that calculators exist. how can a human brain, which isn't capable of performing complex mathematical equations on the spot, design a machine that can instantly handle any equation?
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:44 AM   #435 (permalink)
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I don't have an answer for you. The only thing that will change stuff is a crazy revolution which will leave us god knows where, or some giant war which will also leaves us screwed.

I'd like to believe that we don't have to replace them. They just need incentive to make decisions objectively. I don't know if it's even possible to fix the current system considering how it was initially setup. We may need an entire economic overhaul. I'm not educated enough about the subject to make an informed guess.
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:47 AM   #436 (permalink)
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The Wall Street douchebags were probably the most capable people on the planet at figuring out how economics actually work, and yet even they clearly don't know what they're doing, or at least how to divorce their ambitions from their common sense. If some guy whose entire life revolves around knowing how the economy works doesn't know what he's doing, then what the **** chance does anyone else have?
what makes you say they didn't know what they were doing?
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:48 AM   #437 (permalink)
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The way a computer functions versus the human brain is completely different. All the calculations a calculator makes is just a system of ELSEs, IFs, IF NOTs, etc. Calculators don't make decisions or learn.
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:49 AM   #438 (permalink)
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Where my fellow Left-Leaning Pro-Government Interventionist Bleeding-Heart Libertines at?
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:51 AM   #439 (permalink)
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I don't have an answer for you. The only thing that will change stuff is a crazy revolution which will leave us god knows where, or some giant war which will also leaves us screwed.

I'd like to believe that we don't have to replace them. They just need incentive to make decisions objectively. I don't know if it's even possible to fix the current system considering how it was initially setup. We may need an entire economic overhaul. I'm not educated enough about the subject to make an informed guess.
So long as the current system can be maintained within acceptable parameters of quality of life, then I'm only really concerned in an academic sense. If a dictatorship is the best way for humans to get the most out of their government, then I'm all for it, and likewise, if an uninspiring pseudo-democratic oligarchy based on corruption and the illusion of the power of the people keeps everyone in Pop-Tarts and Cable TV then I'm willing to live with that.

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what makes you say they didn't know what they were doing?
What evidence is there that they do? They've proven that they know how to exploit the economy, but that doesn't mean they understand how it works.
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Old 04-14-2015, 09:56 AM   #440 (permalink)
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The way a computer functions versus the human brain is completely different. All the calculations a calculator makes is just a system of ELSEs, IFs, IF NOTs, etc. Calculators don't make decisions or learn.
machine learning is already a topic of intense research and development. but the calculator example wasn't to say a calculator = a human brain. it was simply to dismantle the logic that a tool that is used to do something can't be used to create a more efficient tool for tackling the same problem. but obviously calculators aren't as advanced as human brains.

the human brain is more mature/complex

it's been around a lot longer

but all it is is an electrochemical network

so it seems kind of silly to suggest that its intelligence can't be reverse engineered
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