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Old 04-24-2011, 07:11 PM   #51 (permalink)
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I remember one of my high school teachers telling us that the word fair should be removed from our vocabularies because in reality life just isn't fair and it will never be no matter how hard we try. He would also tell his sons the same thing to remove the word fair from their vocab because it pretty much doesn't exist.

Also, I read that article a bit earlier when JackPat was asking about it's implemention and sure it discharged 13,000 troops over the time that it was implemented but after 9/11 the number of discharges were dramatically decreased and you can see that over time it was almost as if the policy was slowly being phased out. The strongest branch that was discharging people because of it was the Army and that doesn't even surprise me one bit.
I love the word fair! It is one of my favorite words, dj. Fairness *does* exist. Giving up because it can be hard to attain will solve nothing.

I've been thinking about this thread off and on during the day, trying to think of how to show by analogy how wrong and unfair I feel DADT is, even if it was an improvement over the previous outright ban of gay/bi people from the military.

The best example I could think of is segregation laws. Sure, they were an improvement over slavery. But segregation...and the fact that people supported it for so long...is a shameful part of human history and nothing to be proud of.

Similarly, telling me that if I were to join the military I couldn't acknowledge if the love of my life were a woman, while some officer wears a wedding ring on his finger and openly talks about his wife, his family...is horribly unfair...like a negation of those closest and dearest to me. It is an attack on my "spirit." It's like saying to me, "Yes, you can join the military, but you have to use the back door, and you can't talk." Hmmm...not a pretty picture.

I'm glad if it is true that people have over time been ignoring the DADT policy. It is a bad policy that more people *should* have ignored. A government will only have power if people follow its laws. In my opinion it is sad that more people didn't stand up for fairness from the start.
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Old 04-24-2011, 08:34 PM   #52 (permalink)
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i honestly dont think its gonna kill anyone if the few gay military men/women are open. some may not come out anyway just to avoid awkwardness. LGBT community should be able to be open in the military if they wish though, imo.
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I am just curious to see some statistics on the sexual orientation of the forum's members. I do believe the forum is run mostly of male heterosexual men, and I wonder if the statistics are represented here.
Male men? Are there other kinds of men?
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Old 04-24-2011, 11:18 PM   #53 (permalink)
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I hate the idea of militarism. I am really disgusted by it.
But that doesn't change my 'feelings' (sounds a bit gay ) for Freebase or the DJ. Great people, both of 'em.
What exactly do you hate about it?

I understand the distaste for violence in any context, but fundamentally, the military is "supposed" to provide a defense against any possible violence against its country. If you don't have a problem with self-defense, then the fundamental idea of a nation's military shouldn't be out of line with that.
Obviously, there are a lot of things the military is used for that isn't exactly self-defense... is that what you're talking about?
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Old 04-24-2011, 11:19 PM   #54 (permalink)
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i want to join the Army cos it's, um, to kill people and stuff and I love guns
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Old 04-24-2011, 11:26 PM   #55 (permalink)
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i want to join the Army cos it's, um, to kill people and stuff and I love guns
90sMusicKid, is that you?
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Old 04-24-2011, 11:30 PM   #56 (permalink)
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90sMusicKid, is that you?
dunno who that
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Old 04-25-2011, 02:52 AM   #57 (permalink)
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What exactly do you hate about it?

I understand the distaste for violence in any context, but fundamentally, the military is "supposed" to provide a defense against any possible violence against its country.
The fact that it's neccesary is really what I hate.
And the fact that there's people who WANT to fight other people.
It just doesn't make sense to me.
It's very egocentric of me, but I am really thinking; If this is the way to keep safe, let's just kill eachother. Because this is sick. Fighting for peace? Come on. What are we defending ourselves against? Other people, just other people who are just as good or bad as we are. It makes no sense, really.
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Old 04-25-2011, 04:38 AM   #58 (permalink)
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The fact that it's neccesary is really what I hate.
And the fact that there's people who WANT to fight other people.
It just doesn't make sense to me.
It's very egocentric of me, but I am really thinking; If this is the way to keep safe, let's just kill eachother. Because this is sick. Fighting for peace? Come on. What are we defending ourselves against? Other people, just other people who are just as good or bad as we are. It makes no sense, really.


"Well hello there friends, I see you've decided to occupy my town, welpt... welcome to the neighborhood. Can I get you some treats?"


Give me a f*cking break. The use of violence and peace are far from mutually exclusive.
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Old 04-25-2011, 07:20 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by s_k View Post
The fact that it's neccesary is really what I hate.
And the fact that there's people who WANT to fight other people.
It just doesn't make sense to me.
It's very egocentric of me, but I am really thinking; If this is the way to keep safe, let's just kill eachother. Because this is sick. Fighting for peace? Come on. What are we defending ourselves against? Other people, just other people who are just as good or bad as we are. It makes no sense, really.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

(Vegetius: De Re Militari, 4th century)

"If you wish for peace, prepare for war."

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Old 04-25-2011, 07:25 PM   #60 (permalink)
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"Well hello there friends, I see you've decided to occupy my town, welpt... welcome to the neighborhood. Can I get you some treats?"


Give me a f*cking break. The use of violence and peace are far from mutually exclusive.
So, basically, we need to defend ourselves against time travelers.
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