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Old 10-25-2013, 02:33 PM   #11 (permalink)
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This thread is fecking amazing! I love reading about history and got into ancient civilization through playing Age of Empires. I definitely want to know more about this!
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Old 10-25-2013, 03:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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The Trilithon of Baalbak, Lebanon. It is part of a huge court but no one knows who built it. The smaller stones stacked on top are Roman and one can see Roman columns inside the court (note the human figures for scale). But those huge stones at the base are a mystery. They weigh 1000 TONS each!! The largest dressed stones in the world! Larger than the largest stones in the Pyramids. They are simply stacked together--no mortar--and yet a piece of paper cannot be inserted between them. See how the Roman stones were already breached with a gaping hole but the Trilithon remains untouched and immovable.



The Trilithon are 3 huge stones and yet somehow they were lifted and laid atop smaller stacked stones as one can see here without crushing them. Again, note the human figure for scale. These stones are enormous! When was it built? At least 5000 years ago because that was when the Arabs came into the area but they say the stones were already there and have no idea who did it. The Roman stones stacked on top were put there at least 3000 years later!!!! The Roman stones are less ancient to us than the Trilithon was to the Romans!!


Another view of the Trilithon. Note the tiny human figure at the base of the wall--look REAL close.


But the largest stone of all--1200 tons--was never used but left in the quarry. It is called "the Stone of the South." It is the largest dressed stone known to man and yet we have no idea who made it. It is unimaginably ancient and yet so massive that it has remained where its builders have left it for untold thousands of years. It is so heavy that it is partially sunken into the ground but too massive to move although the Lebanese govt wouldn't allow it anyway--it's a preserved site. With all the wars this area has seen over the centuries, the stones remain unmoved and unmovable, built and laid by unknown hands.




An aerial view of the entire court. The columns are Roman (in fact, the oldest preserved Roman temple is visible). The court itself was made by this unknown race. The Trilithon and breached wall are visible at the left.



We've puzzled for centuries about who built this court and how. Will we ever get the answers? WHO were those people???
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Old 10-26-2013, 11:10 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Another trilithon--this time from Tonga in the South Pacific where one finds all sorts of bizarre things from mysterious pyramids to the Easter Island heads. The trilithon in eastern Tongatapu Island in Tonga called Ha'amonga 'a Maui or “Maui’s Burden” as it represents the great hero, Maui, holding up the heavens. The Wikipedia article on this structure is laughably skeptical and poorly researched saying, for example, that the structure is composed of limestone and weighs 12 tons. The structure is composed three slabs of coral weighing 20 tons each! The slabs were quarried from Wallis Island and brought to Tongatapu. A Wiki article states that the trilithon served as nothing more than the entrance to the court of the 13th century King Tu’i Tonga Tu’itatui and that claims of it having astronomical significance are bogus. According the website run by the Tongan monarchy, the trilithon is, in fact, a sundial. The Wiki article states that this claim was advanced in 1967 as a way of rivaling Stonehenge. The article also states that Stonehenge’s astronomical alignments “are now largely believed to have been overhyped.” In fact, Stonehenge has been proven to be a neolithic observatory. (This was several years ago and I've not been to the Wiki site since so that info may have changed by now) The Tongan monarchy website states:

The sun is extremely significant in Tongan culture, in terms of seasonal periods, measured over years, months and days. The suns duration is measured from sunrise to sunset and seasonal months were divided between sowing, planting and reaping seeds, each dependent on the earth’s rotation. Everyday activities in Tonga are also dependent on the sun, including: fishing, canoe sailing, marriages and construction.

The shortest day in Tonga occurs when the sun is exactly 23 ½ degrees (Tropic of Cancer). When the sun is on the equator, it is moving toward the southern hemisphere and conversely, the northern hemisphere is moving towards the winter. When the sun is on the Tropic of Capricorn, more light is shed in Tonga than darkness. All the three sun markers are indicative of the seasonal changes that occur in Tonga in accordance with the rising of the sun, which is exactly in line with the W etching found on the top slab of the Ha'amonga 'a Maui.

The importance of the Latitude and Longitude of the Ha'amonga 'a Maui is that the coral slabs when constructed on land and are in a position that is high enough to observe the sea horizon when during sunrise. Investigations revealed that not only are the height of the coral slabs scientifically calculated towards the sea, but they are also true magnetic north.

The Ha'amonga 'a Maui has been scientifically interpreted as an early style sundial clock that recorded different seasonal changes. The Ha'amonga 'a Maui fully acknowledges the sea position of Tongatapu and the exact observation of the morning sunrise on the shortest, midway and longest day. How our ancestors knew the science of the sun's positional sunrise along the Tropic of Cancer, Equator and Capricorn remains a mystery.

As a result of the research, the success of the Tongan Maritime Empire has been directly related to the Ha'amonga 'a Maui. The trilithon enabled Tongan leaders to understand the astronomy of the sky, sun routes and was used as a seasonal calendar.


Pshaw! Those silly, superstitious non-Caucasians!
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Old 10-26-2013, 04:36 PM   #14 (permalink)
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And you can find a million creationist websites claiming this proves the earth is only thousands of years old and a million more science websites swearing up and down that this "bad archaeology."
You mean like this one?

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There are the usual problems: whilst there are undoubted resemblances between the shape of the print and that of a shoe sole, part of the imprint is missing. Furthermore, if the imprint really is of a shoe worn by a (presumably air-breathing) human, we have to explain the presence of trilobites, a marine creature. This would have to be not the footprint of a shoe-wearing being walking along a shallow stream, but of one walking on the seabed. Worse, there is no trace of pressure exerted by the supposed wearer of the shoe upon the trilobite (despite the alleged compaction of the sand grains) and the supposed heel is formed by a crack that runs across the whole slab, continuing beyond the ‘footprint’. Similar patterns have been found throughout the Wheeler formation, while concentric oval shapes of varying colour, sometimes with a stepped profile, are what were interpreted by Burdick and Bitter as in situ footprints or sandal prints.
The Antelope Springs

These seem like reasonable objections to me.
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Old 10-26-2013, 06:16 PM   #15 (permalink)
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You mean like this one?

The Antelope Springs

These seem like reasonable objections to me.
And they might be but where is the evidence? They say these simulacra have been found elsewhere but where's the photos? I'm sure markings in rock have been wrongly interpreted many times. But where is the proof that THESE alleged footprints are natural?

And let's suppose these are footprints--would they ever admit it? No. Never. They'll always find some "reasonable objections". They are as bad as the creationists.

I was checking out info on Yonaguni--an underwater rock formation off the coast of Japan that shows signs of having been artificially created. Some geologists insist it is a natural formation and it might be--I'm not convinced either way. I asked on one skeptical website if there were other formations similar to Yonaguni that are definitely natural. A skeptical fellow who claimed to have a degree in geology then posted a photo of the Giant's Causeway in Ireland saying here was an example of a natural formation can produce surprisingly geometrical patterns. I had to point out two things:

1. I specifically asked if there were natural formations similar to Yonaguni. The Giant's Causeway looks absolutely nothing like Yonaguni. If you ask for proof that Farmer Joe grows marijuana in his field and I come back with opium poppy from Farmer Bob's field, what did I prove about Farmer Joe? Nothing.

2. Yonaguni isn't geometrical at all! No one said ANYTHING about it being geometrical. Hell, snowflakes are geometrical, who cares?

Angered that I didn't fold to his superior intellect and education, he began invoking the name of Dr. Robert Schoch, a geophysicist, who had actually inspected Yonaguni himself and pronounced it natural. Schoch was like a god to this guy--"Dr. Schoch said this" and "Dr. Schoch said that". So I did some digging and came across this:

New Era Times - How Many Times has Dr. Robert Schoch been Wrong?

When I sent it to the guy, I never heard from him again. The old "I'll just pretend I went away because I had so many more important things I had to do than sit around debating with the likes of you" ploy.

Likewise, I was arguing with a creationist about the age of the earth and he sent me a link to some so-called geologic proof that the earth is actually very young. The author of the article was listed as Andrew A. Snelling--a geologist. So I looked him up and found this:

Will the Real Dr Snelling Please Stand Up?

It appears Dr. Snelling writes standard geology articles for regular geology journals and creationist articles for creationist journals and websites that reject everything he put forth as fact in his standard geology articles!!!

So, I've learned that college degrees don't always mean anything. I keep an open mind and I use common sense--something both sides of the debate often lack. They may not be foot prints but the size, shape, spatial distance between them, the appearance of a right and left foot and heel marks tells me if these aren't footprints you'd better damn well present some convincing evidence to the contrary. If he's a scientist then he needs to prove his case. Shouldn't be hard the way he dismisses the evidence in this ho-hum fashion.
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Old 11-24-2013, 03:20 PM   #16 (permalink)
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The Serpent Mound of Adams County in Ohio near the Ohio River. It forms a snake with a spiral tail carrying or swallowing an egg.



It's quite large. Measured along its coil and waves, it is 1,370 feet long. It appears to be about 5000 years old. It was first examined by the white race in the 19th century. It is a remnant of a type of amazing earthworks that once dotted this land. Lewis and Clark wrote in their journal of encountering an enormous pyramid during their travels. What became of it is anyone's guess.


Of course, the mound has been discovered to contain all kinds of remarkable astronomical correlations.



The Serpent Mound has quite an interesting story behind it which we'll look at in depth in the next post or two. But for now, I just want to get you familiar with its existence. The story of America is far, far more varied and interesting than the standard accounts of "science" would have you believe. Most of you have probably never heard of this thing. Why? Because science would rather you not know about it because it defies its false and incomplete "histories." So science won't say a word about it. If you want to know about, you have to look. I've looked. And now I'm going to tell you what I learned. It's risky business opposing science and the tragic thing is that I should not have to oppose it. But in cases as this, we are left with no alternative. It isn't so much that science denies certain things, it's that science simply refuses to talk about it that I find so infuriating.

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Old 11-24-2013, 03:29 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I often wonder if these astronomical correlations found in places like the Serpent Mound and Stone Henge are coincidence. Not saying I believe they are coincidence. Just that we don't know either way.
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Old 11-24-2013, 08:19 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Probably coincidence. If I had the choice of expending a great deal of time and energy building a 1300+ foot-long serpent mound in order to calculate astronomical occurrences that might be important to my people or just build one for the sheer hell of it, I'd definitely choose the latter.
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:01 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I was reading up about an early composer a few weeks back and something struck me. The composer was Hildegard von Bingen (1098-1179). She was the daughter of a knight and a tenth child and so was tithed to the Church. She became a nun at age 18. Her teacher was a woman named Jutta who taught her to read and write but Hildegard had a major intellect and began to study everything from art to music to science to philosophy. She is, in fact, the West's first known composer who also wrote the West's first known morality play. She was a physician and had the reputation of being a great healer. She knew a great deal about herbalism and was an early botanist.

She founded two convents, both with running water--something unheard of in Europe for several centuries afterward. She encouraged her nuns to bathe in warm water every day at a time when most Europeans bathed only a few times a year. While the water was fine for bathing, she worried it might be unsafe for drinking and so had her nuns make beer instead (the pilgrims of New England wisely did the same thing). Hildegard was so highly regarded that she shared correspondences with popes, archbishops, kings and emperors. She also corresponded with low ranking members of the Church because she didn't discriminate over social standing. She also spoke out against executions for heresy or witchcraft.

Hildegard suffered from migraines throughout her long life and had visions which she described often in song. This gained her the reputation of seer and prophet although she claimed to be neither. Even in her day, Hildegard was regarded as a polymath and intellectual giant and because popes often read her writings in public she had papal favoritism making it hard for critics and detractors to censure her.

I bring this up because while I was looking at the Voynich Manuscript pages that wrote about on the previous page, it occurred to me that the original author of the work might be, in fact, Hildegard.

For example, I've never seen a full manuscript but I have seen a great many pages. I don't recall any that depicted a male figure. If there are any, they are certainly outnumbered greatly by depictions of women (oftimes nude). This would make sense if we entertain that the author is, in fact, a woman. One illustration shows women bathing and that was one of Hildegard's rules. There are a great many illustrations of plants and flowers which would indicate that the author is well-versed on this topic. So if we deduce the author to be a woman who knows a lot about botany, the only person who fits that description in our histories is Hildegard von Bingen.

I read some bios on her and Wiki has encapsulated the main points I wish to bring up:

"The definition of viriditas or ‘greenness’ is an earthly expression of the heavenly in an integrity that overcomes dualisms. This ‘greenness’ or power of life appears frequently in Hildegard’s works.[47]"

Green seems to be the predominant color in the illustrations of the Voynich Manuscript as well.

"Recent scholars have asserted that Hildegard made a close association between music and the female body in her musical compositions.[48] The poetry and music of Hildegard’s Symphonia is concerned with the anatomy of female desire thus described as Sapphonic, or pertaining to Sappho, connecting her to a history of female rhetoricians.[49]"

The illustrations in the manuscript that depict the human body are overwhelmingly, if not entirely, female. Many of those depictions depict nude women. Since Hildegard spent her life since age 8 within the Church living only with women, it would not be a stretch to suppose she had Sapphic desires. In fact, we should be surprised if this were not the case.

"Hildegard also wrote Physica, a text on the natural sciences, as well as Causae et Curae. Hildegard of Bingen was well known for her healing powers involving practical application of tinctures, herbs, and precious stones.[50] In both texts Hildegard describes the natural world around her, including the cosmos, animals, plants, stones, and minerals.
She combined these elements with a theological notion ultimately derived from Genesis: all things put on earth are for the use of humans.[51] She is particularly interested in the healing properties of plants, animals, and stones, though she also questions God's effect on man's health.[52] One example of her healing powers was curing the blind with the use of Rhine water.[53]"

This appears to be largely the subject matter covered in the Voynich Manuscript. Other illustrations are completely baffling and we don't know what they depict. Let us remember that Hildegard suffered from migraines that caused her to have visions which she talked about a good deal and wrote compositions about them. One source even states that her descriptions of said visions are "enigmatic" and that certainly describes many of the illustrations in the manuscript as well.

"Hildegard also invented an alternative alphabet. The text of her writing and compositions reveals Hildegard's use of this form of modified medieval Latin, encompassing many invented, conflated and abridged words.[6] Due to her inventions of words for her lyrics and use of a constructed script, many conlangers look upon her as a medieval precursor. Scholars believe that Hildegard used her Lingua Ignota to increase solidarity among her nuns.[54]"

Finally, the Voynich Manuscript is written in a code that no one has yet broken.


An example of Hildegard's Lingua Ignota. while it looks nothing like the code in the Voynich Manuscript, who is to say that Hildegard only had one such alphabet? A person of her intellect would likely invent several. I may, for example, invent an alphabet to communicate to persons 1-12 but suppose that I then only want to communicate certain matters to persons 1-4 without 5-12 knowing what said communication was; then, I invent another alphabet that only 1-4 know how to read.

Now some may point out that the paper of the manuscript was analyzed and found to be from the early 1400s, long after Hildegard's death. That only means that the manuscript could be a copy or a copy of a copy. After all, Hildegard was an accomplished artist while the illustrations are somewhat amateurish so the original work may have been copied by someone with modest artistic talent. Some of the plants do not appear to have been copied faithfully depicting plants with leaves too far down the stem and so on. But that would be better than losing the work altogether.

I'm sure I'm not the only person to suspect Hildegard as the ultimate author of the Voynich Manuscript but even if I hit on the idea independently of others, it only adds weight to the idea that she is, in fact, the author.
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:22 PM   #20 (permalink)
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The Serpent Mound has quite an interesting story behind it which we'll look at in depth in the next post or two. But for now, I just want to get you familiar with its existence. The story of America is far, far more varied and interesting than the standard accounts of "science" would have you believe. Most of you have probably never heard of this thing. Why? Because science would rather you not know about it because it defies its false and incomplete "histories." So science won't say a word about it. If you want to know about, you have to look. I've looked. And now I'm going to tell you what I learned. It's risky business opposing science and the tragic thing is that I should not have to oppose it. But in cases as this, we are left with no alternative. It isn't so much that science denies certain things, it's that science simply refuses to talk about it that I find so infuriating.
I'm pretty sure science isn't hiding the serpent mound from anyone. It's a pretty well known thing to most people who've lived in that part of the country.
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