They or Them pronouns
 

I just watched this thing where this individual asks to be referred to as they or them pronouns. Which is something I don't understand. Isn't they or them suppose to refer to multiple people?

I understand it's a genderless word, but it seems counter intuitive to the language to use a words that, from what I've always been told, refers to multiple people.

Wouldn't "it" work better as a pronoun?

If you were on the phone with a stranger and didn't know their gender would you refer to them as it?

"It said the pizza will be ready in 20mins."

We use they and them in the singular form commonly in English, it really takes minimal effort to alter your vocabulary. If you don't want to use a pronoun use their name.

I've never heard anyone use they or them singularly til more recently. Examples?

You probably have and just don't remember. People use they/them all the time; it is not a recent thing. (for instance, when two people are expecting a guest, the person who doesn't know said guest might say "When are they getting here?" I hear people use it in that way all the time, always have)

Here's an example, Blank:

You're with your buddy, when you see a shadow outside. Stepping closer to the window, you begin to make out the silhouette of a person. Though the face and even the gender of the figure are yet a mystery to you, you notice a familiar shape extending out of their grasp.

Friend: What's wrong?

You: I think there's someone standing out there...

You play with the slats to get a better look, but the shadow disappears.

Friend: Are you serious? Who is it?

After peering into the darkness for a moment, searching for the figure, you sigh and give up.

You: I don't know. I think they're gone.

"They said the pizza will be ready in 20mins."

"I was talking to Karen and they can't make the event. I hope they are feeling ok."

"I follow Rex on Instagram and they post a lot of dog photos."

"Everyone did their best on the exam."

I've never heard that. Usually in those scenarios they refer to the person by name, or as an individual.

"I don't remember Casey, have I met them before?"

I hate to come off as this guy, but I never hear this.

That is more in line with what I hear people say.

Whether you've heard it before or not doesn't negate the fact that it is common.

They have an interesting hairline.

:laughing:

It's just polite. And yes, it's used all the time. "John said he was going to pick up his friend, they live over beyond the railway station" etc.

You simply can't call someone "it". It refers to objects, which is why sometimes objects that mean a lot to certain people get personalised, like ships being called "she". Think about how you would like it if someone called you "it". I think the only acceptable time for using that is when there's a newborn baby being discussed and nobody knows what sex it is: "She had a baby. What did she have? I don't know, but at least it's healthy and well."

Here's another example, Blank:

Mindfulness and I had heard the rumors of The Occulthawk, the shadowed archer that had struck down any travelers foolish enough to venture too close to the Glades of Elphenor. An ageless, sexless being shrouded in formless MicShazam-Scale armor, they had long since carved their way into legend. Yet, it wasn't until the dreaded assassin appeared before our caravan that we truly believed the stories. And by then, it was far too late.

Gliding effortlessly through the treetops, peering at us through the worn bandages across their face, the sound of a bow string snapped out as the OccultHawk stalked us, dodging our barrage of magicks with a flash of amusement in their eyes. In spite of all the hours we had spent training under the masters of Lisnahol, we were little more than deer in the eyes of the hunter.

The first arrow sank heavily into Mindfulness's chest, piercing him precisely between the plates of his armor. "Damn," he muttered breathlessly as he tumbled from his Aloysian mare, the poison on the arrowtip already infecting him through his bloodstream.

As the sound of another arrow being let loose cracked through the forest, I pulled up the strongest ward that I could muster, halting the projectile merely an inch from my face. Though I had never quite been able to create a proper ward back in the temple, it seemed that the heat of true combat had forced the proficiency out of me.

Casting the arrow aside, I fired a bolt of searing light at The OccultHawk. Though at first the light bounced harmlessly off of a treetop near the assassin, causing them to let out a dry and sexless laugh, the bolt soon revealed its true purpose in a blinding explosion, taking hold of the archer's bow and casting it away.

Though effective, the spell had drained me of power. Having lost their main weapon, The OccultHawk looked down at me for a moment, appraising me. I don't doubt that they could have finished me then, simply falling from the treetops with daggers steeled, landing before me and cutting me down with an effort quite routine to such an experienced killer. And yet, they faltered. Perhaps out of caution, fearing my magicks, though I wouldn't presume to be so bold as to say that such a fear was warranted. My mind raced as our eyes locked.

The silence of the lifeless forest was broken by a wet sound, a sort of gurgling, as my comrade struggled in vain to return to his feet, blood flowing freely from his mouth. As I glanced at him, he looked back at me with the eyes of a man who knew that death was not long to become his acquaintance. With bloody teeth, he gave me a weak smile. "They got me," he laughed, as if he could hardly believe his rotten luck. He looked down at the arrow protruding from him, almost in admiration. "Good shot," he said, looking back at me and smiling once more. "Damn good..." He fell back to the ground, his eyes quickly losing their light.

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Yep, especially in conversation, we use They/Them/Their even when we are refering to only one person. Here's a couple more examples of how we do it:-

"Someone left their cellphone on the table." It's clearly one person but we never say "his or her cellphone" and we even more neverly say "its cellphone."

Person A: "Hey, there's a person at the door who wants to speak to you!"
Person B: "Whoever it is, can you tell them to wait. I'm just finishing a post on MB."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ______

Another option, which is becoming less and less politically correct, is to just assume that it's a man:-

"I don't know who designed this building, but he did a good job."
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________

Some of the examples posted seem to be mixing up another use of "They", which is when, grammatically, we need a subject for a verb, but we don't know or don't really care who the subject is. We say it without even thinking about whether it's a single or plural subject, e.g:-

"Hey! They've mended the hole in the road!" (If we think about it, probably plural.)
"I went to the shop and they gave me the wrong change." (If we think about it, probably single.)

"They/them" as a singular, third-person, gender neutral pronoun is grammatically acceptable and has been in use for centuries

Hey Blank, do you want some more examples?

They or them is only used in the singular when the subject is unknown or unidentified, to say they or them with an identified subject is retarded and there's honestly no need.

Who gives a ****? Just say "some scum" or something and you won't have to worry about talking to anyone after long enough.

ooookay but what's the point of the they them pronouns

To communicate. Mucho simple.

.

Why would anyone need them outside of an unidentified subject

Machine plays good tracks in plug but I'm not sure they know what they're talking about.

If it's someone's preference then why does it ****ing matter? You seem to have been led astray, miss.

See this just looks so much weirder than just saying "he doesn't know what he's talking about". This might be subjective, but it also feels vaguely insulting. Like I said they or them really only works in unidentified situations beyonf that he/his or she/her is all you need.

For referring to non-binary trans people who prefer a gender-neutral pronoun

There are options outside of they/them as well. I know several people who use ze/zer, for example.

This isn't really an argument you can make in this "oh why does it matter" blase attitude when you have actual governments putting this pronoun into law. And calling me miss is just biologically inconsistent with your grammar. You could make the argument to use these as insulting terms, but pronouns should really be tied to biology or else you end up with a society too afraid to greet one another. This might seem autistic but I think its important and I really couldn't care less who disagrees.

And this is just plain made up.

you watched one too many ben shapiro vids my man

**** Ben Shapiro, **** Jordan Peterson, **** Sam Harris.

uh huh

So how do we account for the population that is neither male nor female. They don't fit into either box you propose, so isn't it logical to create an alternative term? New words are invented and legitimized on a consistent basis, seems you are just uncomfortable with identity politics in general.

That was the point.

Seriously? Gender is different from sex in the sense that it's a mental thing instead of physcial. This is why people say gender instead of sex in these discussions. Also have you never met a person who was androgynous without trying? If you confuse their gender and they correct you, what is your basis for dismissing that afterwards? You're demonstrating a poor understanding of gender so I wouldn't go with your gut feeling over someone's word tbh.

???

I'm not uncomfortable with identity politics whatsoever I think y'all are mistaking me for some enlightened skeptic centrist type. And are we talking biologically intersex or sociological bull****.

Enough YouTube 4U