Rape - Whose Fault Is It?

Trollheart · 07-13-2013, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by misspoptart

Honestly I don't have much left to say about the topic. It seems like those who have chosen to comment on my posts are really more interested in bashing men who they consider to be below them because they made the mistake of misreading a woman's social cues. Also how any of you can claim to know more about it...unless you've been raped or have raped... I think you're just playing the holier-than-thou card. Yep... I am a dumb slut and he was a complete criminal. Is that what you want me to say? :eyeroll:

I don't think anyone implied you were dumb...

Sear-eee-uss-lee, mpt you're one of my favourite posters and if someone hurt you I don't give a **** if you see it as partially your fault, I'm on a plane to Israel to beat the crap out of him. Which is unfortunate, as you live in Turkey, don't you? Shoot! Turn this plane around pilot! Don't **** with me: I have witty innuendo and I'm not afraid to use it!

MPT, you deserve a bear...

Yeh I know it's huge: just an indication of how much I think of you...

#000000 · 07-13-2013, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluffy Kittens

Not having a go but how did you come to that conclusion? 'Usually' the victim's fault?

Anyway seeing as we were discussing rights to anonymity earlier in the thread, this seems a good a place to post as any. Manchester Evening News are at it again:

snip

This lad's reputation is now fucked forever guilty or not.

According to one prominent feminist piece of shit who I can't be arsed Googling at the minute this will do him good because she reckons men benefit from being falsely accused of rape. (That's if it is false.)

(Link snipped because otherwise it won't let me post.)

In some jurisdictions if you're a suspect in a serious crime, law enforcement will try to find you by any means. We don't know what's going on behind-the-scenes but I believe that they usually only divulge names or pictures if they can't find the person through any other means like finding them at home or asking their family and friends.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 216

god i hate feminists. head on over to reddit's /srs section to find complete idiots like that. they dont want equality.

anyways with poptarts situation i think i am understanding better than some people. ive been in situations like that. if you go home with a girl it kinda expected you are gonna get laid. i would be lying if i said i hadnt tried to persuade a girl from having sex in similar situations. if she outright says no thats one thing but if she gives you the 'im not sure' vibe but is still kissing you, then you **** her without explicit consent then you're technically a rapist and i dont think thats worthy of ike 25 yrs in prison

Have you tried seeing the situation from the perspective of the girls you take home, though? Women are often taught that they need to live up to that expectation of sex or think it's rude if they get second-thoughts and say no. If she's giving you the "I don't know" vibe maybe it's just better to stop. It's not just about explicit consent but enthusiastic consent as well, a "yes" that is exorted from a girl isn't really consent but her being afraid that you're going ahead anyway or of being considered rude.

I don't know, if someone I'm kissing gives me the "I don't know if I want to have sex" vibe we just keep kissing if that's ok and if not we just stop. I'd rather have sex with someone who is just into it as I am than have sex with someone who isn't sure about the situation.

misspoptart · 07-14-2013, 12:43 AM

Thanks TH, DJ, Fluffy, and 216, for not only actually trying to see from my POV but also speaking candidly. I sympathize with both the vitims and the rapists in some situations, and although I don't think it's generally the victim's "fault" as BD so brazenly suggested, I do think the victim's actions could damage the rapist more than the rap...ee (?).

Thanks for the bear, TH, but really, as I've said, it was no big deal. I'm ok with what happened, it was a learning experience that I'm grateful for, in a way. The main lesson is that men like that exist. If it happens again, I'll act wiser.

~~Cuthbert~~ · 07-14-2013, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by #000000

(Link snipped because otherwise it won't let me post.)

In some jurisdictions if you're a suspect in a serious crime, law enforcement will try to find you by any means. We don't know what's going on behind-the-scenes but I believe that they usually only divulge names or pictures if they can't find the person through any other means like finding them at home or asking their family and friends.

Like you say, we don't know what's going on but for the MEN to print his picture without knowing the full truth is just irresponsible.

They obviously know it too, because they've taken the picture down now.

Good posts btw & welcome to the board.

Quote:

Have you tried seeing the situation from the perspective of the girls you take home, though? Women are often taught that they need to live up to that expectation of sex or think it's rude if they get second-thoughts and say no. If she's giving you the "I don't know" vibe maybe it's just better to stop. It's not just about explicit consent but enthusiastic consent as well, a "yes" that is exorted from a girl isn't really consent but her being afraid that you're going ahead anyway or of being considered rude.

Hard to argue with any of this, particularly agree w/ the bit in bold.

djchameleon · 07-14-2013, 06:03 AM

If she's giving you the idk sign it depends on how drunk you are because you will just go for it anyways. The more drunk/horny you are is what will determine how you perceive the whole "idk" point.

#000000 · 07-14-2013, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluffy Kittens

Like you say, we don't know what's going on but for the MEN to print his picture without knowing the full truth is just irresponsible.

They obviously know it too, because they've taken the picture down now.

Good posts btw & welcome to the board.

Hard to argue with any of this, particularly agree w/ the bit in bold.

Yeah, I get where you're coming from but it's when it comes to serious crimes, law enforcement has to make difficult decisions. If a suspect has skipped town or mysteriously disappeared before you could get a name and picture, do you just let him go? Or do you try by any means you can to find him so you can proceed with the investigation?

It's an even more difficult choice because most of the time when it happens and it's that important to find people it's usually in serious crimes like rape or murder. Which means that if the person is innocent their reputation will be damaged but sometimes there isn't much choice.

I don't know about this specific case and jurisdiction but I know that many will only divulge names and information about people if they're officially suspects/people of interest with enough to tie them to the case. If it turns out they're innocent that sucks but what if they aren't and you're just letting someone go? It's difficult.

Maybe the guy ended up being cleared or else they found out some other way of tracking him down. It's freaky to think of a situation like that but I can also see the point behind it, if this makes sense.

Thanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

If she's giving you the idk sign it depends on how drunk you are because you will just go for it anyways. The more drunk/horny you are is what will determine how you perceive the whole "idk" point.

Then... what about not going for it anyways? I don't know, I'm prone to getting drunk and horny myself but if my partner is giving those vibes then I just stop and call it a day. As to not perceiving it, maybe it's why clear communication with a sexual partner is important. Even if it's just a one-night stand, I try to make sure they know they can safely back out without getting insulted or forced into anything they don't want to do.

**Scarlett O'Hara** · 07-14-2013, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by #000000

Yeah, I get where you're coming from but it's when it comes to serious crimes, law enforcement has to make difficult decisions. If a suspect has skipped town or mysteriously disappeared before you could get a name and picture, do you just let him go? Or do you try by any means you can to find him so you can proceed with the investigation?

It's an even more difficult choice because most of the time when it happens and it's that important to find people it's usually in serious crimes like rape or murder. Which means that if the person is innocent their reputation will be damaged but sometimes there isn't much choice.

I don't know about this specific case and jurisdiction but I know that many will only divulge names and information about people if they're officially suspects/people of interest with enough to tie them to the case. If it turns out they're innocent that sucks but what if they aren't and you're just letting someone go? It's difficult.

Maybe the guy ended up being cleared or else they found out some other way of tracking him down. It's freaky to think of a situation like that but I can also see the point behind it, if this makes sense.

Thanks

Then... what about not going for it anyways? I don't know, I'm prone to getting drunk and horny myself but if my partner is giving those vibes then I just stop and call it a day. As to not perceiving it, maybe it's why clear communication with a sexual partner is important. Even if it's just a one-night stand, I try to make sure they know they can safely back out without getting insulted or forced into anything they don't want to do.

You sound like a really switched on and intelligent guy. I am definitely going to keep an eye out for your posts. How long have you been with your partner?

#000000 · 07-14-2013, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanilla

You sound like a really switched on and intelligent guy. I am definitely going to keep an eye out for your posts. How long have you been with your partner?

I'm not in a serious relationship right now because I'm happily single. Also because my life right now is chaotic (in a good way) as I've been moving around a lot, so I don't want to force anyone to adapt to my ways or be miserable.

When I said "partner" in my posts, I meant sexual partners in general - more casual relationships, or a potential future SO once my life settles down a bit.

djchameleon · 07-14-2013, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by #000000

Then... what about not going for it anyways? I don't know, I'm prone to getting drunk and horny myself but if my partner is giving those vibes then I just stop and call it a day. As to not perceiving it, maybe it's why clear communication with a sexual partner is important. Even if it's just a one-night stand, I try to make sure they know they can safely back out without getting insulted or forced into anything they don't want to do.

It is easy to say that now while you are sober and your judgement isn't impaired by alcohol.

#000000 · 07-14-2013, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

It is easy to say that now while you are sober and your judgement isn't impaired by alcohol.

That's why I said that you can, at the very least, make sure she knows she can safely back away without feeling pressured to do anything she doesn't want to do. And come on, "but I was drunk" isn't that great an excuse... I used to pick fights all the time when I got drunk, with some work you can change the way your drunk self acts. Plus if you know you're going to get like that, maybe be courteous and don't get drunk near your lady friends.

Then again, even when I'm drunk I'm not desperate enough to have half-hearted sex with someone who isn't really into it.

View Poll Results: Can you blame the victim for getting raped when raping someone is illegal?
Yes	7	13.73%
No	44	86.27%
Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

07-14-2013, 12:43 AM	#133 (permalink)
misspoptart gimme gimme Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: istanbul Posts: 897	Thanks TH, DJ, Fluffy, and 216, for not only actually trying to see from my POV but also speaking candidly. I sympathize with both the vitims and the rapists in some situations, and although I don't think it's generally the victim's "fault" as BD so brazenly suggested, I do think the victim's actions could damage the rapist more than the rap...ee (?). Thanks for the bear, TH, but really, as I've said, it was no big deal. I'm ok with what happened, it was a learning experience that I'm grateful for, in a way. The main lesson is that men like that exist. If it happens again, I'll act wiser.