The Definitve List: Most Overrated Bands\Artists ever (rap, albums)

lucifer_sam · 07-30-2008, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whogivesaflux

art pop is a term I confabulated out of my proverbial cobwebs on the spot. It's a term that for me describes more so an effect the artist/band has socially that constitutes a resulting clique mentality. It's a phenomenon that attaches and best lends itself to a commercial popularity drawn form a pseudo intellectual underground which is in reality neither.

I believe in identifying responsibility rather than the premise. The measure of anything is best taken from result rather than appearance.

art pop to me is not all bad either. For instance, Beck is Art Pop to me and I REALLY enjoy Beck. I just find Radiohead exceptionally boring, "safe", pedestrian, "correct". That sort of thing.

Bottom Line: ANY music that has a reputation that is popular enough to proceed it demands the sincerest of scrutiny from me as a listener and long time musical appreciator. Radiohead did not live up to that reputation for me. I just don't get it. It doesn't challenge me whatsoever. Just like certain people don't "get" Bob Dylan, I don't "get" Radiohead.

Radiohead is NOTHING like The Velvet Underground, I'll give you that. But the Velvets were most definitely the closest thing I can imagine to a pseudo intellectual garage/psych experimental pop group. The very essence actually.

Have you heard the Lou Reed E.A.P. thingamabob? I saw that the other day when I was picking up some new and used CDs. I was tempted to grab it but having been so disappointed with Lou's latter day solo cannon, I opted out.

...

Sorry. I assumed you were talking about art rock, which actually exists. But if you're the person defining the genre, you can claim whatever the fuck you want, huh? Not really much sense arguing.

Shenanigans.

whogivesaflux · 07-30-2008, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam

...

Sorry. I assumed you were talking about art rock, which actually exists. But if you're the person defining the genre, you can claim whatever the fuck you want, huh? Not really much sense arguing.

Shenanigans.

If that's the case you were REALLY off base via The Velvet Underground reference.

Friend, lets bring this full circle to a common ground of intelligent conversation. I took the time to defined clearly what I was referring to via the jargon I used. Maybe that's a misconception on my behalf. I will give you that much. But if all you can do as a music appreciator is be short, sarcastic and withdrawn, how could I possibly see the matter through your ears so to speak?

I have been searching and searching for an enthusiastic and INTELLIGENT music appreciation community. You wanna know what the two biggest draw backs that have hindered that process so far are? <whether you do or don't>

Those two specific handicaps are comprised of age differences (most people under 18 live to insult themselves on message boards, not all though.) and cliques. Thankfully I haven't got a strong whiff of either here yet.

If you REALLY care about music AND communication, you'll avoid dismissive one sentence remarks that attempt to justify your brevity and take the time to honestly spell yourself out intelligently.

What the hell else is personal passion/special interest based discussion for?

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo

I f*cking hate it when people argue over weither or not a band is part of a genre they just made up.

Might try actually defending your position there boo boo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProggyMan

Wtf was that? How are Radiohead safe/pedestrian? They certainly take risks, and they don't really sound like any other band ever...

No edge for me friend. Little groove and very minimal. Lame IMO. About as energetic as a boiled cabbage.

lucifer_sam · 07-30-2008, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whogivesaflux

If that's the case you were REALLY off base via The Velvet Underground reference.

The Velvet Underground were one of the first to use music as an art form rather than a compositional arrangement. (Which is what Andy Warhol intended when he produced The Velvet Underground & Nico). If that doesn't qualify as art rock, "art pop," whatever, then you need to re-evaluate what you think it means.

Quote:

Friend, lets bring this full circle to a common ground of intelligent conversation. I took the time to defined clearly what I was referring to via the jargon I used. Maybe that's a misconception on my behalf. I will give you that much. But if all you can do as a music appreciator is be short, sarcastic and withdrawn, how could I possibly see the matter through your ears so to speak?

I'm being sarcastic and withdrawn because you're not making any collective sense.

Quote:

I have been searching and searching for an enthusiastic and INTELLIGENT music appreciation community. You wanna know what the two biggest draw backs that have hindered that process so far are? <whether you do or don't>

Those two specific handicaps are comprised of age differences (most people under 18 live to insult themselves on message boards, not all though.) and cliques. Thankfully I haven't got a strong whiff of either here yet.

The people here on MusicBanter know what they're talking about. And they don't bullshit about it. Age-elitism isn't a great way to make friends, either. Although I'm only nineteen, Proggyman, one of the youngest members, is just as intelligent and cogent as most of the old farts here. I don't pretend to be the most musically knowledgable or intelligent, but I have enough sense to not make unwarranted and unsupported abjections.

Quote:

If you REALLY care about music AND communication, you'll avoid dismissive one sentence remarks that attempt to justify your brevity and take the time to honestly spell yourself out intelligently.

Okay, let me spell it out, then. In NO way is Radiohead "art pop." Their music expresses a great discord from traditional methods of songwriting, but the music is lyrically, compositionally, and musically structured, like everything else out there. Furthermore, Radiohead has come a looooong way and continue to reinvent themselves on every album. They were built upon an alternative rock single and elected to diversify and produce different music each time they went into the studio. They are overrated by some people, but they are in no way a poor band, bland, tedious, what-fucking-ever.

Quote:

What the hell else is personal passion/special interest based discussion for?

Exactly. So don't take offense when we call you out on bullshit.

End Game.

whogivesaflux · 07-30-2008, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam

The Velvet Underground were one of the first to use music as an art form rather than a compositional arrangement. (Which is what Andy Warhol intended when he produced The Velvet Underground & Nico). If that doesn't qualify as art rock, "art pop," whatever, then you need to re-evaluate what you think it means.

I'm being sarcastic and withdrawn because you're not making any collective sense.

The people here on MusicBanter know what they're talking about. And they don't bullshit about it. Age-elitism isn't a great way to make friends, either. Although I'm only nineteen, Proggyman, one of the youngest members, is just as intelligent and cogent as most of the old farts here. I don't pretend to be the most musically knowledgable or intelligent, but I have enough sense to not make unwarranted and unsupported abjections.

Okay, let me spell it out, then. In NO way is Radiohead "art pop." Their music expresses a great discord from traditional methods of songwriting, but the music is lyrically, compositionally, and musically structured, like everything else out there. Furthermore, Radiohead has come a looooong way and continue to reinvent themselves on every album. They were built upon an alternative rock single and elected to diversify and produce different music each time they went into the studio. They are overrated by some people, but they are in no way a poor band, bland, tedious, what-fucking-ever.

Exactly. So don't take offense when we call you out on bullshit.

End Game.

Man, you talk about self contrived nonsense. Bull**** according to who? You have provided ZERO references to back up what you are contending. ZERO.

Incidentally Art Rock has NOTHING to do with your spouted nonsense about "art used in conjunction" with a music group. That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Art Rock was a term used to denote the most elaborate of PROGRESSIVE ROCK groups like Yes & ELP.

Man, it's not me here that isn't making sense or spouting bull****. People NEED to stop being defensive and start making with the logic. I am still pretty awed by the Urban Hate person. Now that's some tricky logic but you'll understand me better when I reply.

lucifer_sam · 07-30-2008, 01:28 PM

Ahhh, the glory of Wikipedia. And the fallacy of people that read it too quickly and skim too unthoroughly...

Quote:

Originally Posted by whogivesaflux

Man, you talk about self contrived nonsense. Bull**** according to who? You have provided ZERO references to back up what you are contending. ZERO.

"The Golden Age of Rock lectures define art rock as 'a piece of music in the rock idiom that is appealing more intellectually or musically, that is, not formulated along pop lines for mass consumption.'"

Quote:

Incidentally Art Rock has NOTHING to do with your spouted nonsense about "art used in conjunction" with a music group. That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Art Rock was a term used to denote the most elaborate of PROGRESSIVE ROCK groups like Yes & ELP.

I never said it was. In the case of VU, that's what they intended. However, art rock also defines a genre of a "more mainstream compositional nature, leading to experiemntation in this genre." This brings along Roxy Music, Brian Eno, David Bowie...and holy shit! The Velvet Underground.

Quote:

Man, it's not me here that isn't making sense or spouting bull****. People NEED to stop being defensive and start making with the logic. I am still pretty awed by the Urban Hate person. Now that's some tricky logic but you'll understand me better when I reply.

Yes, he's a magnificent specimen, isn't he?

whogivesaflux · 07-30-2008, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam

Ahhh, the glory of Wikipedia. And the fallacy of people that read it too quickly and skim too unthoroughly...

"The Golden Age of Rock lectures define art rock as 'a piece of music in the rock idiom that is appealing more intellectually or musically, that is, not formulated along pop lines for mass consumption.'"

I never said it was. In the case of VU, that's what they intended. However, art rock also defines a genre of a "more mainstream compositional nature, leading to experiemntation in this genre." This brings along Roxy Music, Brian Eno, David Bowie...and holy shit! The Velvet Underground.

Yes, he's a magnificent specimen, isn't he?

You don't have a clue what you are talking about. Now you have clumsily back tracked across your own words. Pathetic. Care to try and justify your ignorance anymore?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifer_sam

Drop the personal insults please.

Sure my hypocritically acclaimed buffoon. Just as soon as you do. None have been flung at me, right? You are are a JOKE.

lucifer_sam · 07-30-2008, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whogivesaflux

You don't have a clue what you are talking about. Now you have clumsily back tracked across your own words. Pathetic. Care to try and justify your ignorance anymore?

Now you're just trying to piss me off. I have no intention to start a flame war. I have expressed a valid argument (supported by real sources), and you haven't objectively refuted it yet. If you want to start a pissy skirmish, I suggest you seek a berth elsewhere.

FaSho · 07-30-2008, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whogivesaflux

age differences (most people under 18 live to insult themselves on message boards

dude first of all i havent agreed with anything youve posted yet....but this ones the worst. im only ****in' 13 and i can hold my own against all these guys without "insuting myself"

and thats just about message boards some of the things you've said about music are so obliviusly wrong that i cant believe someone actually has that opinion!