Music Banter - Is racism REALLY that relevant in music?

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So yeah, todays lession is... a lot of great musicians are racists.

Oh and Morrissey too. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 500249)

Clapton and Costello were both apparrently drunk when they made these statements, to be fair.

There was also something David Bowie said that set people off, but he's always been trying to offend people, and he married a black woman so ehhhhhhh...

Didn't he dress up Hitler-esque at some point and do salutes?

Bah. That was just him being all shock rock.

It humours me how quick these artists go back on their statements, such as Morrissey's statement after his 'reggae is vile' rant.

It ruins their mystique as artists and shows them for the snivelling media hounds that they are. Racism is wrong, yes. But if you are racist, then don't go and ****ing pretend that you're not. And if you are then shut up about it for your own sake. And ESPECIALLY don't attempt to redeem yourself by suddenly spouting off little nuggets of information like 'but I've grown up with black music!!'

However I also think that some of his statements are true, and if he had not gone on to claim how (tongue in cheek or not) by law everything in the charts has to be black music, then I feel he would have had a feasible point of view. Not every form of racism is against black people...

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 500249)

And I believe his current bassist is Gail Ann Dorsey.

Cartman: Token, how many times do we have to go through this? You're black, you can play bass.

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 500249)

Clapton and Costello were both apparrently drunk when they made these statements, to be fair.

I really can't comment about Clapton (never heard of it before this thread, actually), but as far as Costello goes, not only was he drunk (and exhausted from a trying tour of the States), the whole incident was blown out of proportion by Rolling Stone mag, among others. Considering that Costello was greatly influenced by many black artists, I think it's pretty safe to assume that his comments really shouldn't have been taken as seriously as they were. The whole incident was something of an excuse for holier-than-thou journalists to have a few digs at the new "punk" kid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piss Me Off (Post 500147)

Haha i forgot about that rant, forgot when it was, got a source?

It's uncomfortable reading yes. The two ways you could look at it is that there's someone who is either actually biased towards black music due to race or someone who is so biased towards that sort of music that he takes it's popularity as an attack on other music.
The generalising is disgusting to be frank. An attack on modern black music simply because of whats in the charts? Give over. I agree with him on the likes of Janet Jackson and Whitney Houston, their music says nothing to me either but i wouldn't dare use THEM as an example for an attack on a whole race's fucking music. Goes without saying there is far better stuff going on in the underground.

I don't really know what to make of it because, yes it is quite blatantly an attack on race, but then you've Morrissey and his stupid drama-queen double entendres he whips out half the time. You never really know whether he means what he says or not half the time.
"Obviously to get on Top Of The Pops these days, one has to be, by law, black.", could be taken as ignorant and tongue-in-cheek either way.

I know it takes away the mystique he loves so much but i really would love him to take part in an extensive interview over all this to clear it all up once and for all. He's an intelligent person really and should be the last person to be racist, but this kind of thing really does annoy me. One thing for sure is he's a fucking idiot with stuff like this, talk about Bigmouth.

I am a Morrissey fan myself, and I don't think that he's a racist. In fact, he has worked with non-white musicians on his albums such as an Indian violin player on 1991's "Kill Uncle".

What he meant by 'black music is vile' was that too much modern black music is over-dependent on modern technology which takes away the magic of raw talent and that pissed off his musical sensibilities.

It is still true today - look at how many modern black artists rely on electronic fakery like drum machines, auto-tune and sequencing instead of REAL instruments like guitars, piano, brass and acoustic drums.

The blacks invented some of the greatest contemporary music styles like jazz, blues, rhythm & blues, soul, gospel, funk, as well as the Motown and Atlantic soul stuff. Today they waste their time with karaokeized **** about drugs, promiscuous girls and how tough and cool they are. BOOOORING!

Bring back more organic music back into the Top 40 and give the electronic **** a rest!

Why focus on black people though? Is he (and you) saying that white people dont make music that uses drum machines and autotune? Or is it only when black people use the technology is it a problem.

Relevant? No. To be honest, as much as I generally dislike white power music due to it's atrocious sound, and the fact it's used to fund violent organizations. Music should be allowed freedom of speech above all.

I do NOT like white power music that is used to fund the killing of Blacks, Jews, Hispanics, or Homosexuals. I find it vile, and horrible. However, if somebody who makes music is racist or writes racist lyrics, who gives a ****? It's the free world, after all, and all is fair in art.

I'd even go so far as say let it on MTV as long as the music is good enough. I mean, we already have to deal with misogyny nearly to the point of rape fantasy in ****ty music.

Quote:

Originally Posted by boo boo (Post 500252)

So yeah, todays lession is... a lot of great musicians are racists.

Oh and Morrissey too. ;)

Oh, shut up boo boo!

The simple fact of knowing my contradictory post won't be responded to in a long, extremely tedious and mind numbing manner, resulting in an epic flame war of gargantuan proportions along with the usual and predictable mental breakdown, fills me with a calm and overwhelming sense of great satisfaction. :)
Ain't life great?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra (Post 1064308)

:clap:

This is the one and only issue after all, wether it's the subject of racism or misogyny or rape or murder or satan worshipping. It's just words, to paraphrase Zappa, and the minute we start threatening people on the sole basis of what they're saying/writing/singing, that's when we really should start to worry.

who ever said that the media where good guys?

Quote:

Originally Posted by WolfAtTheDoor (Post 499996)

this has something that has angered me quite a bit. Jay-Z recently headlined Glastonbury, something which according to the media upset quite a few people. 'Hip Hop does not belong in Glastonbury' Noel Gallagher said. Rather ignorant of him to say, yes. But is that REALLY racist? Several articles I read about the matter of Jay-Z headlining Glasto seemed to all have the same underlying theme - that the people who were against it, MUST be racist.

Before that, Lethal Bizzle was bottled at Download festival. Yet again, the media pushed it as a racist attack. Lethal Bizzle came out with a statement afterwards, saying that he respected the crowds attitudes and obviously many of them were hardcore metallers who would not appreciate a Rap act coming on stage. He then said that he understands, because if a metal band turned up to a grime rave, things could have been even worse for them. Which is a completely true and respectable statement.

It just angers me, because I do not believe that in these times racism is relevant in music at all. In fact, the media pushing these incidents as racist attacks is simply instigating bitterness between races. I highly doubt that the bottling of Lethal Bizzle was a collective racist assault. It was merely a bunch of metallers who took pride in their genre, and did not want to see some rapper up on stage. Panic At The Disco were bottled at Reading, was that racist? No it wasn't. It was because the crowd thought they were ****.

Music is not something where racism belongs. It isn't like football matches, where a bunch of lunk-headed neanderthals use skin colour to insult the opposing teams players. In music, everyone is in the same team, regardless of race.

yup. racism is not part of the music world at all but it was before.
Girl Time, the first girl group where Beyonce was a member did not won at the mickey mouse talent competition and during interviews, Beyonce stated that it was because they did not perform very well, unlike allegations of racism.

Personally, i believe it was due to racism. i mean, a group of 4 black girls who are so good of a performer would overthrow the whole mickey mouse club where britney is also part of. had they been 4 white girls, i believe the outcome would be different.

but it inspired beyonce to do better and look where she is now?