Deconstruct the Classics!

Josef K · 07-01-2015, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Interesting interpretation. I've always felt it was a sort of cocky proclamation that her life will be worse without him, which I never really thought of as misogynistic. I don't know enough about Cat Stevens in general to be able to make a stance on what he was intending with the song

Yeah, maybe. It's just that it's sort of tough for me to imagine a woman writing that same song about a man.

Moss · 07-01-2015, 10:02 PM

It beats "Go to hell you stupid whore!" I agree its an ex, maybe a bit condescending, but not very misogynistic.

Trollheart · 07-02-2015, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josef K

It's so condescending, so patronizing. The first couple lines establish pretty clearly that it's about a romantic partner who's breaking up with him - would you really tell your daughter whom you love that "I've lost everything to you" and say she's broken your heart? - and then the rest of the song treats her, yeah, basically like a child. I mean, please. It's about how people are really mean and this poor, pure, innocent woman just doesn't get it, and Cat Stevens is just trying to protect her from the nasty old world. Like, "Hope you make a lot of nice friends out there / Just remember there's a lot, I'd beware," is such an asinine thing to say - she's an adult and can use her own judgment. Clearly she doesn't want to do whatever you say, because she's breaking up with you.

Pet_Sounds's reading of the song - it being targeted at his daughter - is wrong IMO, but in a way it's spot-on because it completely shows what's wrong with it. Like I said, he has this image of her as a child who's unable to take care of herself. That's kind of awful.

Still a really good album though.

Jesus H Christ! If I put that much thought into interpreting a lyric (and I do) I'd be told "Lighten up guy! It's just a song!" (and I have been told that). You guys need more to occupy your time.

But since we're suddenly on the subject of breakup songs, let me derail my own thread further and ask you to listen to the lyric on this song, then tell me if this isn't the most selfish **** you ever heard letting someone down not in the least gently, now that he's had his fun.

Trollheart · 07-02-2015, 12:31 PM

As for the album, I'm gonna vote NO. It has "Father and son" on it, but to be fair I don't think one classic song makes an album, and I don't recall anyone ever saying this really influenced their music. Some good songs, but not a classic album for me.

Yes 0
No 3

YorkeDaddy · 07-02-2015, 12:42 PM

I don't really get the criteria here. It's the best album by a very, very famous musician, I didn't realize we're only going for highly influential stuff. Not that I was necessarily voting yes anyway but I guess I just don't see what's so different about this versus Rumours for example

Trollheart · 07-02-2015, 12:45 PM

I think it's all relative. You're going to get a lot of people who KNOW Cat Stevens but couldn't name one of his albums; flip that with Fleetwood Mac. Most people can name Rumours or maybe if they're younger Tango in the Night. There were so many singles and hits and important tracks on Rumours, it couldn't not be a classic, and it was also the classic FM lineup. The thing about our Cat is that he really is known mostly for one, two or three songs, and that's it. I just don't see how this qualifies as a classic album.

But again, it's up to everyone to invent and use their own criteria. I'm not telling you how to vote or how to make up your minds. This is just how I see it for this album.

Josef K · 07-02-2015, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

I don't really get the criteria here. It's the best album by a very, very famous musician, I didn't realize we're only going for highly influential stuff. Not that I was necessarily voting yes anyway but I guess I just don't see what's so different about this versus Rumours for example

Well Rumours isn't Fleetwood Mac's best for one thing

YorkeDaddy · 07-02-2015, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josef K

Well Rumours isn't Fleetwood Mac's best for one thing

Well a lot of people would disagree with that

I guess I'll vote no although I do love Tea for the Tillerman

Trollheart · 07-02-2015, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josef K

Well Rumours isn't Fleetwood Mac's best for one thing

It's not about being best. Black Sabbath got a resounding YES even though a lot of people prefer Paranoid. A band/artiste can have more than one classic album. Would you consider Bad and Thriller both to be classics? It's jsut about whether it deserves to be A classic, not THE classic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

Well a lot of people would disagree with that

I guess I'll vote no although I do love Tea for the Tillerman

So that's 4-0 for No. One more and I'll call it.

Chula Vista · 07-02-2015, 02:52 PM

Wild World was about a lover and how their relationship had ended.

07-02-2015, 12:31 PM	#164 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,970	As for the album, I'm gonna vote NO. It has "Father and son" on it, but to be fair I don't think one classic song makes an album, and I don't recall anyone ever saying this really influenced their music. Some good songs, but not a classic album for me. Yes 0 No 3 __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

07-02-2015, 12:45 PM	#166 (permalink)
Trollheart Born to be mild Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 404 Not Found Posts: 26,970	I think it's all relative. You're going to get a lot of people who KNOW Cat Stevens but couldn't name one of his albums; flip that with Fleetwood Mac. Most people can name Rumours or maybe if they're younger Tango in the Night. There were so many singles and hits and important tracks on Rumours, it couldn't not be a classic, and it was also the classic FM lineup. The thing about our Cat is that he really is known mostly for one, two or three songs, and that's it. I just don't see how this qualifies as a classic album. But again, it's up to everyone to invent and use their own criteria. I'm not telling you how to vote or how to make up your minds. This is just how I see it for this album. __________________ Trollheart: Signature-free since April 2018

07-02-2015, 02:52 PM	#170 (permalink)
Chula Vista Toasted Poster Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: SoCal by way of Boston Posts: 11,332	Wild World was about a lover and how their relationship had ended. __________________ “The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.”

07-01-2015, 10:02 PM	#162 (permalink)
Moss Scuttle Buttin' Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Boulder Colorado Posts: 972	It beats "Go to hell you stupid whore!" I agree its an ex, maybe a bit condescending, but not very misogynistic.